Kinky Autistic Sex Nerd: Jack’s Update
- Luna Robbie
- Feb 12
- 55 min read
Updated: Jun 26
31 genderfluid autistic human, she/they pronouns, single, sex educator, sex researcher, into: sensations, impact play, human sexuality, squirting, sex parties, underwater oral
🔗 JACK LINKS | survey screener / jmurphy@mymail.ciis.edu
00:00:00:02 - 00:00:13:02
Luna
Our guest today is a 31 year old gender fluid autistic human who uses she they pronouns, is currently single, and is a sex educator and sex researcher living in Las Vegas. You can listen to episode 140 The Ugly Game from.
00:00:13:02 - 00:00:16:14
Luna
October 2021. If you want to hear our original episode together with us.
00:00:16:14 - 00:00:23:06
Luna
Today to share updates about their first orgy, a threesome with a very pregnant woman and her partner at.
00:00:23:06 - 00:00:28:17
Luna
A sex club. The first time she fucked a dude in the ass sleeping with their dentist, being mid sex for the first time.
00:00:28:17 - 00:00:30:09
Luna
With a new partner and her dogs.
00:00:30:09 - 00:00:36:15
Luna
Literally shitty response. What they did when the semipublic hot tub to partner shorts as they were getting it on in New.
00:00:36:15 - 00:00:46:14
Luna
Zealand, and the awesome research that they are currently conducting that explores the intersection of kink and autism, which you can participate in and I am very, very interested in.
00:00:46:17 - 00:00:49:07
Luna
Welcome back Jack.
00:00:49:09 - 00:00:51:05
Jack
How am I? Thank you so much.
00:00:51:07 - 00:00:55:07
Luna
Oh my gosh, I am so excited to talk again.
00:00:55:09 - 00:01:07:22
Luna
I first just want to say, for anyone who has not listened to Jack's original episode, one of the best communication lessons that I think I have received, or rather it stands out in my mind, is.
00:01:07:22 - 00:01:09:14
Luna
When you just told.
00:01:09:16 - 00:01:30:07
Luna
Your partner that you're like, nope, that was bad sex, you know? And then you had a whole conversation about it. Like, that always stands out to me. So before we get into your excellent updates, just little update overview, like it sounds like maybe as an educator, your communication abilities are only getting better. You also have identified gender fluidity in yourself.
00:01:30:07 - 00:01:36:02
Luna
Like is there any any top notes that feel relevant to, sharing before we dive into specific updates?
00:01:36:02 - 00:01:57:10
Jack
I mean, I think it kind of all ties together, right? The more we learn about ourselves, the more we learn, just in general, the better we can communicate what we like, what we don't. And I think the gender fluidity was always there, but not necessarily something that I could communicate or had, like vocabulary to explore and just in natural consequences.
00:01:57:10 - 00:02:14:00
Jack
I think of my program in my research and personal learning around autism, gender identity and all those things. It kind of just fell into place. I don't think it's necessarily new, but it's definitely new that I can communicate about it. If that means.
00:02:14:02 - 00:02:15:05
Luna
Yeah, well.
00:02:15:05 - 00:02:30:10
Luna
I know that the more that I learn, the more I have language to discuss concepts that maybe I felt. And lately I have had like an uptick in people being like, you put exactly what I was feeling into words, and I was like, yes, my studies.
00:02:30:10 - 00:02:34:05
Luna
Are paying off. Haha. And you also have like.
00:02:34:09 - 00:02:54:11
Luna
More explicit knowledge about yourself as an autistic human, right? I think you and I had talked about this when we spoke the first time, but there was not any sort of like a reality in labels. And I'm a I'm like a self labeled, while I say probabilistic because I'm probably autistic and I read a textbook and it sounds like it, but, what's that little piece of your journey been like for you?
00:02:54:13 - 00:03:18:18
Jack
Yeah, I think yeah, when we discussed it, I was in that same phase of like, I thought it, you know, people have mentioned it around me. I've worked in the field of individuals with disabilities, and it's always kind of been like a joke. But, I did actually have the privilege to seek formal diagnosis and went through a series of assessments, which again, I think for me, I really enjoyed I like having information.
00:03:18:18 - 00:03:45:08
Jack
And so being able to read it and see someone else's person, I like point of View who did the assessment and learn more about strategies and tools that could help me. It wasn't like groundbreaking. Like, oh my gosh, I had no idea. But I do think it pinpointed some things I didn't really even realize, actually, when I was doing the assessment, part of it was a self report, and when I completed it, the psychologist asked me, she was like, you know, this isn't exactly what I was anticipating to see.
00:03:45:08 - 00:04:04:17
Jack
Could you complete the self report with somebody who knows you well? And at the time I had a partner of several years, and so we did it together. And that was probably the most eye opening thing is it was asking about things, particular like things about maybe, social scenarios and routines and things that I was like, oh, no, I'm totally fine.
00:04:04:22 - 00:04:28:08
Jack
And my partner would be like, I wouldn't necessarily agree with that. And so we scored it together and the results were dramatically different. But I think it was probably more accurate in terms of how I was navigating the world. But it just, you know, I've done it my whole life. And so when I redid it and again, was meeting with the psychologist, she's like, yeah, that's kind of more when I was anticipating.
00:04:28:08 - 00:04:44:05
Jack
And she gathered it from just our, you know, several sessions together, I think it was over like 7 or 8 sessions. But, it was, it was things that I didn't necessarily see, but talking it through with someone who knew me really well and kind of goes through the world with me at my side. It was like, wow.
00:04:44:07 - 00:04:51:00
Jack
Yeah. And so I think it was eye opening to a sense, I think about that a lot, actually.
00:04:51:05 - 00:04:52:04
Luna
Was it like.
00:04:52:06 - 00:05:01:23
Luna
You are so good at coping mechanisms that you didn't understand difficulties or like, what were the parts that were kind of like revealed to you?
00:05:02:00 - 00:05:35:09
Jack
Good question. I think both I think some of the things that I just felt like, well, everyone struggles with this, like, you know, it's not that big of a deal, you know, putting into perspective of someone who else has been on this planet for, you know, plenty of years and seeing other people navigate similar challenges and be like, no, that's not really how a lot of people handle, you know, if, let's see, plans change by an hour and you have to do it like that's not the normal response, like the way I feel because routines and schedules and plans is something that really is difficult for me when they change.
00:05:35:12 - 00:05:53:23
Jack
Yeah, I just thought that was because I'm organized. But, you know, I think it has more to do with some other things or, or social nuances that I'm like, oh yeah, I can totally pick up on this or that. And, and my partner's like, no, like and has ready all these examples. And then I start to realize it now, for example sarcasm.
00:05:53:23 - 00:06:10:22
Jack
I always thought like, I'm pretty sarcastic, but I hear it all the time that I'm always asking people, are you being sarcastic? Like, are you? Are you being sarcastic or being serious? And I think I'm so good at it, but but I realize now, no, I'm really not. And I am always actively seeking. Wait, are you being sarcastic?
00:06:11:00 - 00:06:15:00
Jack
But without thinking about it, I thought for sure. Yeah, I understand sarcasm.
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Luna
I don't, and also I have a phrase where.
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Luna
I'm like, I'll like stare blankly at a person. I'll be like, is that a serious or a joke? You know, like and like I had a partner.
00:06:24:22 - 00:06:26:09
Luna
Who.
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Luna
Was kind of my person to bounce off, like, am I getting sarcasm? And because I know oftentimes that I don't get it. And so there was a moment where I was like, that's a serious. And he's like, no, that is exactly sarcastic. Like I was like, it's a joke, but it's not a sarcastic like, nope, that one was exactly sarcasm.
00:06:41:05 - 00:07:02:17
Luna
And so it sneaks up on me so often. But then also sometimes when I am trying to do it, people then think that I'm even when I'm mirroring, then they think I'm being totally serious and I'm like, I'm literally matching your tone and style, you know? So it's, I mean, but you're right, I guess. I guess not everyone does struggle.
00:07:02:19 - 00:07:05:00
Luna
With the same amount. Do you feel like.
00:07:05:06 - 00:07:11:12
Luna
Learning more about your neuro type has affected your sex life and or work?
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Jack
Definitely. I think relationships outside of, you know, I'd say all around, because I communicate it, I share it with people, and I think it usually goes one of two ways. One, people are really receptive and ask, like, how does that like, what does that mean for me? Like, how can they if I'm looking at a friendship or dating relationship or sexual like what?
00:07:36:04 - 00:07:43:18
Jack
Which way does that show up and what can they do to support me through that? Or it's the we don't seem autistic. And then it's kind of.
00:07:43:22 - 00:07:50:09
Luna
Like, oh, not, you know, you. And I'm like, it's okay.
00:07:50:11 - 00:08:14:21
Jack
Sexually, I'm not sure. I think I think it's allowed me to lean into things that I've already been interested in. I explore, I think, more sensory play, and I've been exploring like understanding why I think some things I like, but it's not sexual at all for me, for example, flogging or getting hit. I really, really like enjoy it.
00:08:14:21 - 00:08:34:07
Jack
And I've come to realize this, but I don't know if it turns me on. I think I just like it, and I haven't met a lot of people even in this research or something or later, but that I'm still trying to figure out which things I just like, because I like the sensation in which things are arousing and can it be both?
00:08:34:07 - 00:08:45:12
Jack
And I'm kind of exploring that space, but I think there's been more room for accepting it outside of sexual experiences with the understanding sensory play.
00:08:45:14 - 00:09:08:17
Luna
I love that you brought that nuance up. I have a friend who is very big in the community, and there's there are these like fights that are ongoing about rope is not sexual, rope is two sexual. And I'm like, I kind of skirt the entire issue by just being like, well, for me, in my own life, I don't draw a distinction between erotic and non erotic.
00:09:08:17 - 00:09:33:12
Luna
Turn on if something is exciting to me. I think in science texts they use the word arousal, which is kind of a neutral term, but it doesn't necessarily mean sexual arousal, but it can. But it's just like I'm in an alert state. And so for me, I, I have a hard time parsing what isn't sexual because I certainly have boundaries in my life.
00:09:33:12 - 00:09:44:00
Luna
I am certainly excellent at enforcing boundaries, which is one of the reasons that I have. I'm so good at accidentally exploding people when they are, unclear about where the boundary is, or they're trying to unconsciously cross it. And I'm like.
00:09:44:00 - 00:09:45:01
Luna
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
00:09:45:03 - 00:10:22:10
Luna
But I do not really have that distinction. Like, if blood flow is going to my genital area and I am in a place where I'm allowed to be sexually turned on by it, I probably will be. Now, that said, it doesn't mean that I necessarily have desire to fuck the person flogging me. Like for me, their context is hugely important and that's why, you know, like I have gone to events or parties where they're like tops giving tastings and I'm using air quotes where it's like, you know, sensation tasting or they're helping kind of people experiencing something new.
00:10:22:12 - 00:10:44:08
Luna
And because there's no relational container, or rather because the relational container is a very clear like, I'm helping you explore this thing. Like I'll receive the sensation and get generally aroused, but I'm not like in the sexual turn onto them. So I don't know if that's what you're talking about, but I also, I'm so curious about how you could get flogged because I'm imagining the.
00:10:44:08 - 00:10:56:18
Luna
But I mean, or like usually for me, I've experienced flogging on my back, away from the kidneys, on my ass, on my thighs. You know, those are kind of the go to oh, I've also had some mean hits on my palms and feet.
00:10:56:18 - 00:10:58:23
Luna
Ooh.
00:10:59:00 - 00:11:06:00
Luna
And I think for me, when blood flow is happening, I do get aroused. But also I'm sort of a highly arousal, like if blood is flowing through my body.
00:11:06:04 - 00:11:07:12
Luna
Which is all the time, then.
00:11:07:12 - 00:11:14:05
Luna
I'm pretty. Yeah. So, when did you first realize that maybe you were not turned on by flogging?
00:11:14:07 - 00:11:33:22
Jack
I think maybe what you're saying, like, has relevance. I was in a public space. I was at a sex club here, and I think it was one of my first times. And they have, like, a kink designated room. And there were educators who were educating around how to flog, how to do it safely, which I just loved. And I'm like, nerding out.
00:11:33:22 - 00:11:55:21
Jack
I think that's also part of me shifts into like nerd educator mode, and I'm learning and I'm co-teaching. But there was an individual who was flogging who. I didn't know them. There was no connection. I wasn't physically immediately attracted to them by any means, but I did want to let them essentially beat the shit out of me. And I think it was that experience that I still really liked it.
00:11:55:21 - 00:12:01:10
Jack
And, all the areas you mentioned, but also they do like a tick tick flogging like a V.
00:12:01:12 - 00:12:05:06
Luna
I do. Yeah. Oh.
00:12:05:08 - 00:12:18:18
Jack
And it, it, I like when I see this human in the community I like they know it because I'm. And I'm always like they're great. You got to let them do it. I don't know that it was sexually arousing, but now I'm kind of like, it's kind of like you said, it's it's hard to tell. I'll enjoyed it.
00:12:18:18 - 00:12:33:08
Jack
I don't know if it was sexual or I just enjoyed it. That was kind of the beginning piece of like, I why am I what about this? Do I like and and where does it leave you or and I don't know, but yeah, the V.
00:12:33:10 - 00:12:37:05
Luna
Natalie recommend screams oh, man. Okay, before we get into details.
00:12:37:05 - 00:12:51:19
Luna
Of your first orgy, were there any, like, tips or tricks like from that class? I because I always want to have opportunities to educate. Although it is not your job here to be an educator. But like any stand out pieces of information for people who are new to flog.
00:12:51:21 - 00:13:06:18
Jack
When I meet people who have never done it before, just really knowing that the tools that you use, like the type of flogger or the type of, tails that it has, if it's a single tail like whip, it makes all the difference, like some people really don't like. I don't like stingy.
00:13:06:18 - 00:13:09:18
Luna
I like okay, okay, okay. Yeah.
00:13:09:20 - 00:13:31:23
Jack
Certain things. But also since I'm vegan, it's hard to find good quality non leather, or no animal product like foggers. But what was my advice? Just like, I don't know, try, try a lot of different things because and that's why I like going to places where they have like tools that are there to use. So you can experience a bunch of different types of things.
00:13:32:01 - 00:13:40:15
Jack
Yeah, what you like, and then move forward from there. Because there's so different and I wouldn't have believed them. And also they sound, it sounds sometimes a lot worse than it feels.
00:13:40:17 - 00:13:55:11
Luna
Oh yeah. And sometimes it looks worse than it feels. I will always remember my first kinky threesome. Like kneeling there on the floor, like holding the dude's drink, being like, why am I holding a drink? Like I'd never done that sort of surface before. And I was like, this is stupid. And then I was watching his partner, who.
00:13:55:11 - 00:13:56:08
Luna
Was a big.
00:13:56:08 - 00:14:09:12
Luna
Pain slut, like, get the shit beat out of her. I later learned it was a very thirsty experience. And so like the thing that I was sitting there being like, why did I agree to do this? I don't think I'm kinky after all. Never mind, never mind. Then once I got the physical sensation, I was like, I love this.
00:14:09:12 - 00:14:10:11
Luna
I will never not.
00:14:10:11 - 00:14:16:06
Luna
Do this again. You know? Like it was like just opposite ends of the spectrum. So I love that. Okay, okay.
00:14:16:09 - 00:14:17:22
Luna
Oh, I could talk to you forever, but but.
00:14:17:22 - 00:14:26:09
Luna
Let's tell us, please tell us about your first orgy. You've had your first orgy? What happened? How did it come to be? What was it like?
00:14:26:09 - 00:14:30:14
Luna
Would you do it again, etc.? Tell us your orgy thoughts.
00:14:30:16 - 00:15:00:13
Jack
Yeah, so I was actually going to a new sex club that I had never been to, and I asked a friend here if she would go with me. She'd never been to anything like that, and part of it was like I had to do an ethnographic assignment for school, which is basically you have to get it done. And I thought that would be more fun, which is basically just a nerdy way into like, write about a space and like show that I could take data on, like what a space looks like.
00:15:00:15 - 00:15:21:08
Jack
And I chose to do it at a sex club because that's more interesting than, I don't know, going to the library. And so I go there with my friend, and this was a new place that actually had like particular rules in terms of, because they're all different in terms of like they had a, the bracelet system. So you wear certain color bracelets if you're interested in playing colors versus if you're not, if you're a couple things like that.
00:15:21:10 - 00:15:40:06
Jack
And so my, friend and I went and we wore like bracelets that said we were a couple but not really interested in play. And I'm just trying to, like, take in the space, learn the rules, how people are navigating. And her and I have not we're not that close of friends at this point. And at the time, I thought she was strictly dick.
00:15:40:10 - 00:15:59:09
Jack
But we'll see that this is not necessarily the case. But we go in and we meet someone and they ask like, hey, do you want to watch my friend? He's having sex in another room. And we're like, yeah, totally. Because sometimes there's not a lot going on or it takes one person to start. But someone approached us was like, there's someone who's having sex actively.
00:15:59:09 - 00:16:12:23
Jack
Do you want to come watch? We're like, yes, absolutely. So we go into this room and I'm talking with my friend again, this is not her norm. And I'm telling her like, hey, we got to kind of like make sure we like we got to be respectful. Like, we can't be laughing. We got to just like, hold it together.
00:16:12:23 - 00:16:30:19
Jack
And she's like, yeah, yeah, for sure. And we go in and we're sitting on a couch, probably two feet from the bed where two people are having sex and it's me, this dude, and my girlfriend, and we're sitting here and we're watching and we're just watching them have sex. And if you listen to my previous episode, you know, I've never actually seen porn really, since, like, seeing porn live.
00:16:30:19 - 00:16:49:12
Jack
And, you know, again, this is an example where I'm, I'm so happy to be here, and I like being in these spaces, but I'm not necessarily turned on by watching these two people have sex. It's not like a sexually arousing thing for me. And then the guy in the middle starts hyping up the guy in the bed and he's like, get it?
00:16:49:18 - 00:17:06:15
Jack
That's right. Get it, dude. And I, for whatever reason, the hype man just I just could it and I like, start laughing. And I'm trying so hard to not laugh and and I'm not making anyone uncomfortable. But we get past the laughing and, you know, they do their thing and they and their beautiful, beautiful couple having sex and they finish.
00:17:06:15 - 00:17:25:18
Jack
And I literally say out loud, should we clap like I like, like when you tell me to clap, it's done. And so, you know, I kind of finish what I thought I needed to do for research. Why? So then it's now it's I can play. And the gentleman on the bed I like approached him and he was like, do you want to like make out or whatever?
00:17:25:18 - 00:17:42:14
Jack
I'm like, yeah, sure. But I was a little bit worried about my friend. We go into another room and we're making out and I hear this noise, and then I look over and it's my girlfriend who's just, like, making out, kind of getting it on with this other dude. And I'm like, okay, that's fine, you know? Whatever. So we start making out and then it's all four of us in the bed.
00:17:42:14 - 00:17:58:01
Jack
And then like, people are coming and they're like, hey, do you mind if we join this, like, beautiful girl? And I'm like, yes, please do. Like, oh my gosh, you know she'll do. Partner joins and some guy comes in and there's just like, I don't know all these bodies on the bed. And it's not at all what I thought was going to happen for the night.
00:17:58:01 - 00:18:23:05
Jack
But super fun and confusing and meeting. And it was all great until somebody bit my clit and I my response was to hit them in the face because I was never happened to me. Also had a couple also like and I was so like upset that that had happened. But I so I didn't have penetrative sex I guess, in this orgy.
00:18:23:05 - 00:18:34:04
Jack
But other people were just a lot of like, oral sex, making out lots of bodies. It was fun. It was a lot of fun. Not. Definitely not what I thought was going to happen. But. Yeah.
00:18:34:06 - 00:18:54:20
Luna
Wow. The tale of the unexpected orgy is wonderful here, but I, my brain is still wrapping around the clit biting. What the fuck? Like I would say, this is not typically an advice podcast unless people specifically ask me a question. However, as a general rule, I would say don't fucking bite a stranger's clit. Like negotiate that.
00:18:54:20 - 00:18:57:05
Luna
That's very specific to things.
00:18:57:05 - 00:19:09:06
Jack
I think it was a bite, but the only other possibility was the very attractive human, but a wide gap. The only other thing I was like is somehow like the gap teeth. Good. Like.
00:19:09:08 - 00:19:09:15
Luna
I.
00:19:09:15 - 00:19:13:22
Jack
Don't know how that could have been. That's the only other thing. I think they had to have a bit of bite. But either way, I have.
00:19:13:22 - 00:19:16:06
Luna
Had people like suck so.
00:19:16:06 - 00:19:34:15
Luna
Hard, like, I'm going to do anyone with misophonia skip the next five seconds because I'm going to lick my finger and suck it really hard, like I've had people like sucking my clit so hard that it goes. And it it's so strong and powerful that they're like. And it creates this like terrible for me. I have a very sensitive clitoris, so it creates a terrible pain.
00:19:34:17 - 00:19:41:07
Luna
So I don't know maybe that, but lol the idea of your clip being sucked into a gap tooth and it pinching is.
00:19:41:09 - 00:19:42:14
Luna
Not like.
00:19:42:14 - 00:19:46:09
Luna
It's not what one would imagine when you hear first orgy, but also.
00:19:46:10 - 00:19:47:14
Luna
What a cool surprise.
00:19:47:14 - 00:19:50:00
Luna
00:19:50:02 - 00:19:50:17
Luna
Have you had.
00:19:50:17 - 00:19:54:05
Luna
Orgies since then, or does this leave you inspired to have.
00:19:54:07 - 00:19:55:05
Luna
You know.
00:19:55:07 - 00:20:01:09
Luna
Different elements in your future orgy? Or like what? Where does it leave you when you come to thinking about orgies now?
00:20:01:11 - 00:20:15:05
Jack
I'm definitely open. Yeah. No. I'm open. I think I would do things more safely, like people that I know or in terms of, like, testing things like that. But yeah, no, I'm open for sure.
00:20:15:10 - 00:20:17:09
Luna
I don't love that.
00:20:17:11 - 00:20:37:23
Luna
I've been noodling a lot lately on wanting to do things with people I know and realizing that my own little social sphere of like, what if I do not read their signal and that they are my friend? So they lie to me because sometimes friends do that because they don't want to hurt your feelings. And so I'm like, oh, I just don't have like enough go to IRL sexy community.
00:20:37:23 - 00:20:41:22
Luna
It sounds like that's something you have been building right?
00:20:42:00 - 00:21:05:07
Jack
Yeah. I think little by little, building. I think that's a good point. I, I often find myself around individuals who are not like in the community where I'm like, oh yeah, everyone in this room, I've had some type of sexual intimacy with. And to me I'm like, totally, okay. Some of these people were my closest friends. Some people are exes, but for other people, not in that world, it's definitely more of a challenge, like when it comes to dating.
00:21:05:11 - 00:21:24:18
Jack
And then I am just a full disclosure of everything all the time, because that's what I think people would want. So sometimes that means like, hey, just so you know, we're going to go to this party, this person, this person, this person. And I realize, you know, I'm learning that not everybody wants all the information. So yeah, slowly but surely, I think building that.
00:21:24:20 - 00:21:25:22
Luna
Yeah, yeah.
00:21:25:22 - 00:21:41:15
Luna
Navigating the differences in people's preferences combined with many people's desire to not be explicit about those preferences, is perhaps the single most.
00:21:41:17 - 00:21:42:15
Luna
Difficult.
00:21:42:17 - 00:22:03:23
Luna
Thing for me when it comes to sex in a personal life context. I'm like, you know, and I practice talking about it all day long for work. What is it like among your academic peers? Like are they open about their own lives? I imagine a lot of people who study sex must be kinky. Then again, I imagine for some of them, maybe the kink is studying it instead of doing it.
00:22:03:23 - 00:22:09:06
Luna
Just based on some of the conversations I've had. What is the vibe like there?
00:22:09:08 - 00:22:31:20
Jack
Yeah, well, my coworker is very small and even now it's smaller, like the, you know, there's a large attrition and I think I really only am connected closely with two people in my cohort. And the one I'd say is definitely in the community has experience as a sex worker, things like that. And the other one, you know, is largely sex is kind of asexual.
00:22:31:22 - 00:22:49:06
Jack
But like when I went to school, when we were together, like we went to the sex club together in San Francisco, that was one thing that we all did. I think I was the only one who was actually single and could, like, play. But we all went together and it was, you know, they were all rooting for me and trying to help me get laid.
00:22:49:08 - 00:23:01:18
Jack
A lot of them are therapists, and so they're going the route of, like, sex therapy. So it's not as involved in like, kinky Bdsm as much as they are just open around like sexuality.
00:23:01:20 - 00:23:04:02
Luna
So. Okay.
00:23:04:04 - 00:23:10:05
Luna
I would love to hear about your threesome with a pregnant woman and her partner.
00:23:10:06 - 00:23:12:03
Luna
At a sex club.
00:23:12:05 - 00:23:30:02
Jack
All right. This is actually the first time I went to the sex club. I actually met someone at the dog park, and she shared that she was kinky, and I was like, great. Me too. Let's talk about this. And so we made a connection and she was like, I go to the sex club during the summer here, and they do naked pool parties, like, do you want to go?
00:23:30:02 - 00:23:46:20
Jack
And I was like, yeah, absolutely. And so it's like, bring your own alcohol. It's during the day. And everyone was completely nude. And so that was my first. So I go there and I'm outside and I'm like, chicken, everyone out. And I'm excited to be there because I haven't been in that space before. And I had just moved back to Vegas.
00:23:46:20 - 00:24:05:12
Jack
And so this was like maybe a month or two being here. And, you know, she's very social and I'm not so sure, but I'm like mingling with people. And I see this woman in the hot tub and I'm thinking, oh, she's cute. And I see her like, you know, you're up and, she's a redhead and, like, looks kind of nerdy.
00:24:05:12 - 00:24:28:20
Jack
And I'm like, oh, she's really cute, you know? And I, I like, go over to, like, chat with her. And, I'm not really good at eye contact, actually, people who are watching this can probably see I'm looking everywhere else, but, I'm, like, talking with her, but maybe not necessarily looking at her. Ton and I chat with her, and then I leave and go and sit back down, and she gets out of the hot tub later and I see, like, she's very pregnant.
00:24:28:20 - 00:24:48:09
Jack
It's just so beautiful. But I didn't not realize she was like, like six, seven months pregnant, like just very pregnant. And she comes over with her partner and they invite me to play and I'm like, oh, you know, I'm not really, like, ready. I'm kind of like, you know, just kind of hanging out. And they're like, well, we're going to go to the kink room if you want to go later and just watch or something.
00:24:48:11 - 00:25:08:01
Jack
And so I'm like trying to get the courage up and I like go over there and I'm like sitting. And he has her on this thinking bench and he's like using these like nail like cloth things like on her back and on. And I'm just watching and and I'm just talking with everyone and everyone's so lovely. Like, again, there's a lot more like natural.
00:25:08:02 - 00:25:30:10
Jack
I'm using air quotes, normal conversations at these places than people would realize. But we're talking and, you know, they're definitely interested in play, but I'm just kind of getting warmed up. And plus, the horse they took, they spent a long time with me, just like talking with me and making me feel comfortable. But then it was like all these other people in the club who knew this couple and were like, oh my gosh, he's like, amazing.
00:25:30:10 - 00:25:41:17
Jack
Last time he was here, he lined up nine women and made them all square like one by one. And then some dude was like, oh yeah, he, you know, fucked my wife last time and it was so good. So now I'm like, okay, I'm a little bit so.
00:25:41:18 - 00:25:43:14
Luna
Social proof marriage.
00:25:43:16 - 00:26:03:00
Jack
I was like, I'm never squirted before. We're talking about this. And like everyone's backing him up. So I'm like, okay. Like I'm kind of interested. So we end up after a long time. Again, thanks to them, we go to a private room to like kind of start like getting it on and we start making out. I'm not really sure what you know.
00:26:03:00 - 00:26:20:00
Jack
I'm not pregnant. I've never been pregnant. I've never definitely had sex with a pregnant woman. So I'm not exactly sure how in what to navigate. But man, that was like her husband put in so much work. That was the first time ever someone use, like, a double sided dildo between the two of us. He did make me squirt, too.
00:26:20:02 - 00:26:39:21
Jack
So my first time squirting, And he. It was great. It was so much fun. And. Yeah, they were so are so I've seen them again since, and they're just so, like in love and comfortable. I remember thinking like, this is really beautiful for them and kind of strange for me, but they were just like, I love you so much.
00:26:39:21 - 00:26:57:08
Jack
And like, she's so beautiful and this is so great. And they were just, like really complimentary. But also like, really intensely, like in love with each other. But, no, it was I think it was great. And we ended up having a good time and. Yeah. No, I have no complaints.
00:26:57:10 - 00:27:01:22
Luna
I love that so much. I have a follow up question about squirting, about.
00:27:01:22 - 00:27:09:04
Luna
The double ended dildo, and about the part that was awkward for you was it will go backwards. Was it the intensity of their love like and being so.
00:27:09:04 - 00:27:20:21
Luna
Close to it? Cause I think that is actually my favorite thing about being with couples, because I'm a total cheerleader and like, yeah, love each other. Kiss now go do it, you know? And and for me, sometimes it's like too scary to be in.
00:27:20:21 - 00:27:22:07
Luna
That or I'm like, I don't know, don't cling to me.
00:27:22:07 - 00:27:25:12
Luna
I don't know. So it's like, what what was experience like for you?
00:27:25:14 - 00:27:47:04
Jack
I think it was the first time. I'm trying to think like chronologically. I've had threesomes before, but not super successful ones. So this was like the first time that I was with a married couple. So I was like the third person and it was just like I was. I think I just found myself thinking a lot, like, could I ever like, how would I feel if I were in this position?
00:27:47:04 - 00:28:07:02
Jack
Because the only reference I had was the threesome. That was me and my partner and another female, and it was not so great. And so like, I was really intrigued by their passion to each other, but their ability to enjoy it with me, since I had a threesome with actually a very good friend of mine and my ex, and it was the most beautiful.
00:28:07:02 - 00:28:14:09
Jack
And I get it. I get it now. But at the time I was like, oh, this is so interesting.
00:28:14:11 - 00:28:16:09
Luna
Yeah, I love, oh.
00:28:16:09 - 00:28:36:13
Luna
I love that. I have only a couple experiences having like where I'm the main partner, me and my partner person, but we still weren't like an exclusive couple bringing in an outside person. I am so much better at being the third wheel, or rather, so much more experienced. They're all fine, but it is a totally different experience, you know, having all of that.
00:28:36:15 - 00:28:37:03
Luna
I still.
00:28:37:04 - 00:28:41:08
Luna
Think having a threesome with a couple who is clearly very in love is.
00:28:41:08 - 00:28:42:04
Luna
Much.
00:28:42:04 - 00:28:43:17
Luna
Preferable to the ones where I'm like.
00:28:43:17 - 00:28:50:06
Luna
Do you have a luggage? Other like that one? I'll be like, oh, I'm gonna disappear forever now,
00:28:50:08 - 00:28:59:02
Luna
Squirting for you. Does it come with an orgasm? What's the intensity like? What was your experience with it like? And have you squirted since.
00:28:59:04 - 00:29:17:18
Jack
Yeah. So I think for me, again, going off of both of him and his wife so that it did square it was definitely. It's a feeling that I can describe. But it's separate from orgasm. It's a different type of feeling. And it wasn't like what I probably imagined was like shooting out. I think it was more just like it came out.
00:29:17:18 - 00:29:18:07
Jack
It was very.
00:29:18:07 - 00:29:18:15
Luna
Well.
00:29:18:19 - 00:29:19:09
Luna
Gushes.
00:29:19:09 - 00:29:21:03
Luna
Yeah, I love it and.
00:29:21:05 - 00:29:39:10
Jack
I've done it since, so since I like, because again, they were super lovely and talking and he was talking about it while he was doing it, and I could realize like where he was kind of pressing in my body and what that feeling was since then, like, solo and masturbation and also with partners, I can tell, like what that feeling is like.
00:29:39:10 - 00:29:58:12
Jack
I've had partners be like, I want to make you cum. Like, this isn't gonna make me come, but this will be like, make me squirt. Like, this is a different type of feeling. I think I have maybe a couple times, but it's not necessarily something that I do a lot or that I'm like, oh my gosh, I really loved that feeling.
00:29:58:14 - 00:30:03:23
Jack
So yes, yes, yeah, I have, but it's not something I do all the time.
00:30:03:23 - 00:30:22:10
Luna
Oh, I'm curious if it's going to change over time, because for a while I had partners that would, like, make me squirt, and it was completely separate for work from orgasm. And it was only through interviewing people that I'm like, wait, it sounds like some people assume squirting comes with an orgasm. Which is why I ask now, because it's different for everyone and I don't, you know, we don't know until we know.
00:30:22:12 - 00:30:28:15
Luna
And then I have had some really intense orgasms that came with squirting.
00:30:28:17 - 00:30:33:20
Luna
Literally, you know, and so I so I will be curious to hear about your squirt journey. Okay.
00:30:33:23 - 00:30:41:08
Luna
I've never been double into dildo in that way before. Was it like a big one? Was it like, what was it?
00:30:41:10 - 00:30:46:23
Jack
Yeah, it was definitely just like a big one with like, he had it and he, like, we were laying.
00:30:47:01 - 00:30:48:00
Luna
Like.
00:30:48:02 - 00:30:52:09
Jack
Over two bolts, if you will. And then just like, going back and forth, I will.
00:30:52:09 - 00:30:56:02
Luna
Vulva devil. That's so cool. What did it feel like?
00:30:56:04 - 00:31:05:08
Jack
I mean, again, his hands down to him, he put it I just I say he put in work all the work. Like it was great. Yeah. I don't, I don't know that I could describe it outside of that.
00:31:05:08 - 00:31:07:00
Luna
Well I guess I'm like, I like.
00:31:07:00 - 00:31:18:12
Luna
Most of the penetrative sex that I've had has some form of like, am I understanding correctly? You were both like laying vulva, the vulva. So like maybe on your backs or sides or okay.
00:31:18:14 - 00:31:19:10
Luna
On.
00:31:19:12 - 00:31:38:12
Luna
So I'm used to like the pressure from a pubic bone in most grinding situation, you know, or like that, you know. And so it's like having that ooh. Although I do have a fuck machine now and that has fucked me horizontally. So maybe that's the closest I could imagine. Are you a person? Remind me, can you come from internal stimulation alone?
00:31:38:12 - 00:31:47:09
Luna
Are you a external like were you also, were you just like, lying there, receiving the back and forth? And did you feel energetically connected to her, or was it just like hot because of the scenario?
00:31:47:11 - 00:32:09:04
Jack
I don't know in terms of if I could remember, like what I was feeling in my body. I think it was a lot of things. It was like, oh my gosh, like, this whole thing is happening, but I don't necessarily come from penetration alone. However, what I have noticed has shifted. I don't know how long ago, so I don't remember what I said in my last episode is I really do like penetration to orgasm before I used to never really care about it.
00:32:09:04 - 00:32:29:07
Jack
I think I was really clitoris and the rest is nice, but I could care without it. But I've noticed now even if I'm going to masturbate, I really enjoy penetration will get me there so much faster than if it's just clitoral stimulation. And I'm. And I know that, like you know, from a anatomical sciencey way, internal stimulation is often internal stimulation of the internal clitoris.
00:32:29:08 - 00:32:38:13
Jack
It's not just like, but, yeah, I'm definitely way more into penetration now than I see, like I was in my previous decade of sex.
00:32:38:17 - 00:32:39:14
Luna
Yeah, yeah.
00:32:39:14 - 00:32:47:16
Luna
That's so cool. Yeah, the more I learn about anatomy, the more I'm like, oh, okay. So my vestibule has a lot of nerve endings. Oh, so my.
00:32:47:16 - 00:32:51:19
Luna
Clitoral hood is quite small. Not for my clit. So sensitive, you know, like like.
00:32:51:19 - 00:33:10:15
Luna
Learning all the parts and pieces. And then just how. I don't know if I've told you, but I do. In September is now for the last two years I have aged myself all month long. But I do a masturbation meditation sensation exploration. So every day for like 10 to 20 minutes I will touch myself. This year I alternated between hands and toys.
00:33:10:15 - 00:33:38:09
Luna
Last year I forget how I organized it, but, you know, so I'm I'm basically finding a new way to touch myself every day for 30 days and trying to not cum, which I fucking love because I learn so much about my body. But going back to something you've said when you were talking about being kind of in sex educator mode or paying attention to like receiving new information mode, and then like, you know, the experience you just shared where you're like, I don't remember exactly how I felt in the moment.
00:33:38:11 - 00:34:19:01
Luna
You know, I have been clocking, obviously most of the time when people are just deeply experiencing something, they're not like, okay, brain record now, you know? And I've realized that one of the things like, I get so much pleasure from paying attention to details, but I think for me, I still am very present. And so obviously there are parts that I don't remember, but I can really, really relate to what I think you were saying, which is like, I find myself in moments where I am in a high state of arousal, but if it's novel, i.e. new information and I'm so excited by something new, it may be at odds for the type of like
00:34:19:01 - 00:34:32:07
Luna
relaxation that it would take to get me to climax, or kind of like lose myself in that way. However, for me that is not separate from turn on or pleasure. It's just a different variety. And I've been realizing that like.
00:34:32:07 - 00:34:37:09
Luna
Learning is a big turn on for me, you know, especially if it's sexy. But even if it's not. So.
00:34:37:11 - 00:34:47:01
Luna
That's what that sure made me think of. Anything else to save from the experience with that couple? Like, have you had pregnant lady sex since then?
00:34:47:03 - 00:35:06:15
Jack
I have, actually a funny, I we exchanged information and I never heard from them. And then I saw them again at a sex club, and they realized they wrote my number down wrong. And they shared with me a text that the husband had sent. Like, I had so much fun with you and so and so, like, hopefully we can, you know, go again.
00:35:06:15 - 00:35:15:12
Jack
I love you, square. And the response I got was like, don't know who you're texting. I'm a dude. And I'm. So I thought that was.
00:35:15:14 - 00:35:20:21
Luna
Oh, I'm so glad you ran into them again though. Rather been like, okay. Well, I don't think.
00:35:21:00 - 00:35:42:03
Jack
We haven't had sex again, but they have been there and I, I often take friends and people who want to go to the sex club. And so they were there. What I most recently took actually a coworker and again, just so lovely and let my friend come in and watch him do all these things to his wife and, you know, now she's, she's no longer pregnant, but, yeah.
00:35:42:05 - 00:35:44:01
Jack
Wow. Just lovely.
00:35:44:03 - 00:35:51:13
Luna
I fucking love that. Okay. Now, could you please tell us about the first time that you fucked a dude in the ass?
00:35:51:15 - 00:36:16:01
Jack
Oh, yeah. I was, seeing someone here, and they are bisexual. And I think for a long time, in my mind, I was like, you know, female, female is hot, female dude is hot. But a dude and a dude. It's just so cute. I love it. It's like, didn't necessarily, but I was dating someone and he was bisexual, and he would start telling me about having sex with men and I'd be like, man, this is really hot.
00:36:16:01 - 00:36:16:10
Jack
Like this.
00:36:16:11 - 00:36:20:04
Luna
Totally get turned on by gay things of all directions.
00:36:20:06 - 00:36:37:17
Jack
And so I was like, oh, I just didn't even know. And, as we were hooking up and we got like, closer, he was just like, I like, you know, would you try? I'm very much I'm a sub through and through, I won't lie. But, you know, we were hooking up, and he's like, I'm kind of interested.
00:36:37:17 - 00:36:51:12
Jack
And, like, I had maybe played with his ass a little bit, but never to the point of, like, penetration, especially with, like, a dildo. But I was like, yeah, I'll give it a go. And first of all, I think it's way harder to use a sex story than it is your hand because, like, you know exactly where you're at.
00:36:51:12 - 00:36:53:15
Jack
It's it's hard when you have no feelings.
00:36:53:16 - 00:36:56:14
Luna
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:36:56:16 - 00:37:17:10
Jack
But somehow, I don't know honestly, like, kudos to him. Kudos to me. It went very well. He was very pleased and it was really hot to me. Like to be able to. Yeah. Like I really enjoyed it too which surprised me and like me making him cum was like making myself cum. I was like, yeah, it was great.
00:37:17:12 - 00:37:18:18
Luna
Oh yeah. So good.
00:37:18:20 - 00:37:45:15
Luna
That's so, so good. I definitely, I'm keen to have a partner who I can like as fuck a lot, like, so I can get, because I have a couple of strap ons now, and I'm, like, feeling pretty, like, competent. But like you said, still want more experience. You know, using my dick, like, it's really my dick because I know, some of my gay friends are like, oh my God, my partner is just so good at, like, using her dick and then I'm like, I want to be that good.
00:37:45:15 - 00:37:46:15
Luna
Like, I know that I'm.
00:37:46:17 - 00:37:47:09
Luna
Good, but I want.
00:37:47:09 - 00:37:50:23
Luna
To get next level good. And then yeah, having having that practice.
00:37:51:01 - 00:37:54:21
Jack
Yeah. I didn't use a harness. I was actually using like it was I think I was holding.
00:37:55:01 - 00:37:56:19
Luna
Oh that's good too.
00:37:56:21 - 00:38:00:17
Luna
I think that's really wise for first time too. Yeah.
00:38:00:19 - 00:38:19:07
Jack
I recently was playing with a couple and they were asking me if I would like wear a harness and, you know, have sex with the female partner. And I was like, honestly, I feel like it's going to be hard. I think I'll get tired, but I'm like toned down to try. But I've never I've never done that. But I am.
00:38:19:13 - 00:38:23:13
Jack
Maybe next time I'll update on that. I have not yet used a harness to fuck anybody.
00:38:23:13 - 00:38:47:02
Luna
I mean totally and honestly dude, this is literally the thing that keeps me like coming back to my 30 minutes a day of like body weight and or cardio now and not every day, but like three to 5 or 6 days a week, depending on what my schedule can manage. Even when I'm traveling, sometimes I'm like, no, but I want to be able to fuck like an eye with or without a strap.
00:38:47:03 - 00:39:10:23
Luna
Like if I now, just because of this, the last few years of these, like medium baselines of like again, 30 minutes a day, like I can be vigorous for 30 minutes a day. And the exponential difference that it's made in my ability to be the actively fucking partner rather than the receiver is. I'm like, if someone had told me like if PE in like middle school, high school had been like, prepare your body for.
00:39:10:23 - 00:39:14:22
Luna
This, I think I would have been a lot more motivated.
00:39:15:00 - 00:39:33:04
Luna
If and when you do strap someone, have you actually even worn a strap? Like have you seen yourself wearing a cock? I will be very curious to hear how that lands on your genderfluid self, because I. I was wearing like a white V-neck and just strap and cock and I was like.
00:39:33:04 - 00:39:42:17
Luna
Oh, I look good. Ooh, look at me like I had such a, it's such cock feelings. And I was like, okay, I'd never I didn't expect that. But I loved it. So I'll be curious to hear how it lands on you.
00:39:42:17 - 00:39:46:11
Jack
I did, Betty Dawson, I don't know if. Yes, yes, yes.
00:39:46:15 - 00:39:51:03
Luna
Wait. I literally just got her book on audible.
00:39:51:05 - 00:40:18:02
Jack
I have a good friend who, you know, trained. And Betty Dawson was like, her mentor, and we did a body sex workshop. And one of part of it is like a circle jerk. And you have the one. Right? And I remember standing with, you know, female identifying humans in the circle, and we all had a magic wand, and I was like, this seems so phallic because they're so, you know, they're big and we're like, sitting and holding them, like, on our, clips or genitals.
00:40:18:02 - 00:40:24:20
Jack
And so I wonder if it'd be a similar experience to that, because I remember standing there with all of those people being like, this kind of feels like I'm holding a dick right now.
00:40:24:20 - 00:40:26:09
Luna
Yes. Oh, I.
00:40:26:09 - 00:40:35:09
Luna
Fucking love that. I love, oh, there's so much to experience out there doing. Tell me about the experience of you and your dentist.
00:40:35:11 - 00:40:57:07
Jack
So I, you know, I'm single, and I just moved here, and I was trying to, like, meet people, but it's really hard. And I needed a dentist. And my friend referred me to him, and he was really good looking. And I was like, wow, maybe this is like my story. This is like how I'm going to have like my meet cute or whatever it is that they say it's not going to be online to be my dentist.
00:40:57:07 - 00:41:15:21
Jack
So I asked the hygienist, you know, hey, is there like a code between, like, dentists and patients or can, like, inches of here? Are you interested in. She's like, are you interested in doc? And I'm like, oh gosh. She's like, he's the nicest guy. He's so sweet, blah blah blah. She's talking about. But I'm like, okay, girl.
00:41:15:23 - 00:41:34:04
Jack
And then he comes back and she's hyping me up. She's like, oh, you know, Jaclyn is so smart and she's seeing that she's doing her PhD. And like he's like kind of being flirty. And I'm like, okay, this is interesting. And I, I've just done like Invisalign. So I knew I had to come back. So that was kind of I came back a couple times and we were very flirty, but nothing much.
00:41:34:09 - 00:41:54:13
Jack
And I was like, okay, my next appointment, I'm going to ask him out. But I was on the online dating apps and he had like swiped to like, like me. And so I sent him a message and I said, oh, well, this is much easier than asking you out at my next appointment. And he responded was like, oh, I didn't even realize it was you.
00:41:54:15 - 00:41:56:05
Jack
I don't know if that's true or not.
00:41:56:07 - 00:41:57:18
Luna
But anyway.
00:41:57:20 - 00:42:25:21
Jack
We make a date. And unfortunately we go to this date and he comes in and he just really, like, is giving, like, the party boy dentist rich vibes, if you can imagine. And I'm really not interested. And then we have a conversation about trans individuals which we just don't have the same beliefs. And I'm already kind of like, oh, like, okay, you're like not not doing it for me.
00:42:25:23 - 00:42:49:19
Jack
But sometimes I still am really curious about how people have sex. And so I did go to his house and again, he's talking about how it's all like custom and blah blah, blah and boujee, this one. And he's saying things like, oh, we look so good together. And it's really like grossing me out. I'm really not interested. But why am I still I still didn't stop.
00:42:49:19 - 00:43:03:19
Jack
I still was like, I got to go through with it. And I honestly, I really a trick I think I do have is I can usually tell what someone's penis is going to look like. I'll come back to that. But I kind of already knew that he was going to have a small penis, and he did, and that's fine.
00:43:03:19 - 00:43:20:04
Jack
Like that was not the problem. So we're hooking up. We're making out, and I'm going down on him and I'm like, there's like hair in my mouth, but like, I can't get it out. And he has no animals. And so I'm just like, oh, this is weird. Whatever. And we're continuing and he I'm sure he comes and we finish or whatever.
00:43:20:04 - 00:43:39:14
Jack
And and he's like, did you get here in your mouth? And I'm like, yeah, like a lot. And then he tells me that he like went to the gym and showered. And then he manscaped and then he did not shower afterwards. So I just had like, mouth full of loose pubes. And I was so upset because I think that is so rude.
00:43:39:16 - 00:43:48:10
Luna
It's like, you know, for these pubes, I'm losing it. It's not. Oh.
00:43:48:12 - 00:44:06:06
Jack
I leave obviously not thrilled. And he still texts me like a day or two later. He was like, hey, how are you doing? And I kid you not, I have the screenshots to prove, I respond. I said, still working on getting the hair out of my mouth because I was just so like, it's not like ouch, brutal or whatever.
00:44:06:07 - 00:44:20:14
Jack
I don't know what he said. And then I was like, word of advice, like if you manscaped shower afterwards, it's just rude. And then he still asked me out again. But we did not ever go out again. And we saw him repeatedly for like probably six.
00:44:20:16 - 00:44:24:22
Luna
He was my next question. So you still had Invisalign?
00:44:25:00 - 00:44:33:23
Jack
I still was seeing him for the rest of my dental work. And yeah, no, I have a different than just. I did finish my Invisalign there. I went there until my insurance changed.
00:44:34:04 - 00:44:37:00
Luna
But yeah.
00:44:37:02 - 00:44:46:18
Jack
And the hygienist stood me wrong like she stabbed me wrong. She she was a good way. Yeah, he's definitely wrong about who he was and what he wanted.
00:44:46:19 - 00:44:55:10
Luna
Yeah. I mean, or she just clearly had a very different set of values than you. Can we circle back to.
00:44:55:10 - 00:45:01:00
Luna
You were the second person lately to be, like, I can tell what the clock is going to be like.
00:45:01:02 - 00:45:03:07
Luna
Well, what is your method?
00:45:03:09 - 00:45:06:11
Jack
I, I don't know what it is like.
00:45:06:12 - 00:45:09:12
Luna
Through sixth sense 6 or 7 sense.
00:45:09:14 - 00:45:26:03
Jack
Extra skill, I don't know, but I bring it up only because more recently I was talking to someone. I met them one time, were a friend of a friend's partner, and, I don't even know what we're talking about, but I was oh, I was guessing kind of how kinky they were or whatever. And he was like, actually, that's pretty spot on.
00:45:26:03 - 00:45:41:13
Jack
I was like, great. Do you want me tell you what your dick looks like? And he's like, yeah. And so I described it, what I imagined. And he, he literally said, that is eerily spot on. He's like, he's like, I can't even tell you how many people. One of the words I said, I said was probably a very, like, beautiful penis.
00:45:41:13 - 00:45:57:05
Jack
He probably is a very good looking, like, not too big, but maybe a little bigger than average anyhow. And he was like the amount of times people have called my penis pretty. He was like, I don't know how you knew that. He was like, is this something you could do? And I'm reflecting back. I think I usually I've only been surprised twice.
00:45:57:05 - 00:46:04:01
Jack
Other than that, I think I'm pretty pretty much know what to expect. I don't know how I, I don't know how.
00:46:04:01 - 00:46:05:08
Luna
So it's just so you are.
00:46:05:08 - 00:46:12:08
Luna
Literally just like, you're like, channeling class.
00:46:12:10 - 00:46:18:01
Jack
Yeah. I was wondering if I told this, if people are going to contact me and solicit and be like, what do you think my cock looks like? But, well.
00:46:18:01 - 00:46:28:03
Luna
If they do, make sure to charge them. That's something that I learned I was accidentally giving away for free as a podcaster for years. And then one of my friends was like, that's sex work, girl, get paid for that. And I was like, oh.
00:46:28:05 - 00:46:30:07
Luna
I that's a whole thing, you know?
00:46:30:07 - 00:46:45:08
Luna
And ironically, I get very few requests for dick readings now that I actually have an OnlyFans. Like I've gotten like a handful or two over the years, but I'm like, not nearly as many as I would like. So I just have since like them in person.
00:46:45:10 - 00:46:45:23
Luna
Which is.
00:46:45:23 - 00:46:54:00
Luna
My favorite. I don't think I have ever called a cock beautiful or pretty. I might have to use it. Like now I'm like, oh.
00:46:54:02 - 00:46:57:22
Luna
Like like part of me is like, it's not just what other people say. And I didn't know, is it?
00:46:57:22 - 00:47:04:11
Luna
Is that a compliment or descriptor that you find yourself using often, or did you just like, no.
00:47:04:11 - 00:47:06:09
Luna
That his was beautiful.
00:47:06:11 - 00:47:15:23
Jack
I think it's a descriptor I use often with a specific type of penis like, and I feel like his would fit the category.
00:47:16:01 - 00:47:20:03
Luna
Did you ever get to actually look at it, or did he just tell you no.
00:47:20:03 - 00:47:22:22
Jack
This is literally like two days ago. I haven't seen it yet.
00:47:23:01 - 00:47:39:04
Luna
Okay. Oh, okay. Okay, okay okay. Oh my God, I love this. I love this so much. Oh, man. Okay. Tell us the story of having sex with a new partner and your dog having a certain kind of reaction.
00:47:39:06 - 00:48:02:11
Jack
This is actually a good story. I think there's probably a couple things you'll like about it. This is someone I've known for a long time, and we kind of always like. We're never single around the same time, but may be interested in each other all the way back to like, high school. And so we both were single and we like, go on this date and we love being around each other like we're good friends, but we've never, like, take it to the next step.
00:48:02:11 - 00:48:22:08
Jack
So it's kind of awkward, kind of like you're feeling it out and we like start to kiss. And we have very different kissing styles. And I'm, I feel like they kiss with a slightly closed mouth really fast. And I don't know if they were excited to. So I literally like, stop them. I put my hand, I was like, take a breath.
00:48:22:08 - 00:48:40:16
Jack
Like, calm down. Like, let's go a little slower. You know, in terms of like speed of kissing, not like in terms of progression to like sex. So we're trying to figure it out. We move into the bedroom and I have a senior dog, a German shepherd, and she's laying in the bed and he's super nervous. All the animals, he's animal.
00:48:40:16 - 00:49:05:09
Jack
So she's staying in the bed. We're kind of like making out, trying to figure it out. It's kind of awkward. We're like stumbling over, you know, trying to figure it out. And like, we're getting undressed and my dog gets up and gets out is like walking out of the bed, but literally shits in the bed, like, just, you know, she was very old and she couldn't hold her bowel movements that had never happened.
00:49:05:09 - 00:49:26:19
Jack
She had definitely not made it out the dog door, but never like in the bed. And so for naked and I have a king size bed, but like, it's like rolling towards. Like in the bed and it sinks down a little bit. So it's like going towards us. So like we're trying to get up and I'm just mortified.
00:49:26:19 - 00:49:43:18
Jack
I'm just like, I need him. Then he needs to leave, like leave the bedroom so I can like clean it up. And I just don't even know what to say or do at this point. My sister, I think it's like they were like, did you smell it for. It was like a combination. Like you saw it, you smelled it came to her.
00:49:43:19 - 00:49:45:05
Jack
It was like all at once.
00:49:45:07 - 00:49:47:06
Luna
So.
00:49:47:08 - 00:50:10:12
Jack
Yeah, man. So that was. But, you know, we cleaned it up, we changed the sheets and we gave it our best go. And then this is the second part. We're having sex. And this is someone who has, you know, he feels very confident. He has shared before about partners. Really like being surprised with him as a lover. And I will say he was, you know, really good with his hands.
00:50:10:12 - 00:50:35:11
Jack
Oral sex is really good, but we're having sex and it's like the best way I can describe this is the vibrator settings that no one uses. It's like. And he's like fucking like that. Like he's like, he's like thrusting like this and like, I can't, like, get the rhythm and I can't, like, get close. And it's so weird to me.
00:50:35:11 - 00:50:55:08
Jack
I've never had sex like that before. I just couldn't, I just couldn't, like, get it to match what I was reading was so inconsistent. And so afterwards, you know, eventually when things and I told him, I'm like, you know, I don't know how familiar are with like, vibrators and settings and I because I do a debrief, I always do a debrief after sex where I.
00:50:55:13 - 00:50:58:10
Luna
Literally you are my inspiration.
00:50:58:12 - 00:51:13:17
Jack
Were you know, we share what we liked but we didn't like what maybe we change for next time. And so I was trying to describe this to him that like he I was like, you remind me of like a sex toy. And he was like, oh, that's great. And I'm like, no, hold on. Like, let me explain more.
00:51:13:19 - 00:51:28:10
Jack
And so I like show him from like a vibrator that I have in like the different settings. And he's like this. I still think this is like the best compliment. I'm like, no, like, I'm telling you these, like, I feel like a lot of other people are like, who uses these settings? Nobody. It's either the B or the.
00:51:28:12 - 00:51:44:21
Jack
Yeah, but nobody uses you. Yeah. And so I was showing you there's like all these viral videos and stuff of people commenting on the settings. But I told them I was going to come on this podcast and I said, do you mind if I share this? And he's like, he's still like, no, it's really great sex. Like, I don't mind if you share it.
00:51:44:21 - 00:51:56:19
Jack
And I so I don't know if he didn't like, understand that I was saying like that was really not my jam or if it was just me and everyone else likes that, I don't know, but I think about it. I think about it a lot.
00:51:56:21 - 00:51:58:11
Luna
That is.
00:51:58:13 - 00:52:29:12
Luna
Thank you for sharing all the levels of that. Actually, that is such a brilliant story on so many levels because it's like, look, maybe it's not perfect. Look, maybe there's a little moment of bed shooting, look, we can come back to this look, okay, maybe the rhythms just aren't lining up and we try to communicate about it. And sometimes, no matter how, no matter how far I go to do my literal best at communicating my perspective, sometimes it just doesn't quite land the way I think it's going to end.
00:52:29:13 - 00:52:33:01
Luna
I guess that's okay. But it's that's very interesting, because.
00:52:33:03 - 00:52:59:01
Luna
My only experience with people where I could not get them into the rhythm is where I'm basically training someone who is new to partnered sex. Right. Like, and so then I'll, like, grab their hips and be like, like this, you know, or I'll show them, I'll switch back to manual stuff and I'll be like, I'm going to put your hand on my pussy and put my hand on your hand, and I'm going to show you, like how it feels just to get into flow with another body.
00:52:59:01 - 00:53:06:19
Luna
It's a different medium. But like, you know, letting the body sync up. But I mean, sometimes it just doesn't work. That is so interesting.
00:53:06:21 - 00:53:15:07
Luna
That your communication efforts did not yield the light bulb moment. It sounds like.
00:53:15:09 - 00:53:34:11
Jack
Really having sex with people who really like it. Again, he has other great qualities. Maybe they just never spoke to it, but it was just so I don't know. It was very strange. Like recently we talked about hooking up and I was thinking, do I want to do that again? I don't, I don't think I want to yeah.
00:53:34:13 - 00:53:35:20
Luna
Yeah, I really.
00:53:35:20 - 00:53:46:04
Luna
Have over the past few years, had to train myself to notice that I have this streak of intense curiosity that will do the same thing over and over again, just to.
00:53:46:04 - 00:53:53:18
Luna
See if it's slightly different this time, because oftentimes it is, you know, and then oftentimes it's the same in a lot of the same ways that I'm like, no, I maybe I don't need to.
00:53:53:18 - 00:54:01:06
Luna
Explore it again. So it sounds like you're achieving wisdom in some way, shape or form.
00:54:01:08 - 00:54:09:05
Luna
Could you please tell us about this hot tub moment where the shorts got eaten? But yeah. What exactly happened?
00:54:09:07 - 00:54:16:05
Jack
I went with my ex to, went to New Zealand, and it was just beautiful. And there was honestly.
00:54:16:06 - 00:54:17:06
Luna
Like.
00:54:17:08 - 00:54:44:17
Jack
It's like the most beautiful. They're like private hot tubs and it's like open. So you can see outside of New Zealand, it's just gorgeous. I don't even know where it's at, but just perfect. It's cold outside the hot tubs warm. It's really boujee. I don't even know how expensive it probably was. But we are in there and, you know, it says like, keep your clothes on very discreetly and whatever fancy language.
00:54:44:17 - 00:55:01:20
Jack
But basically they're like, don't fuck in the hot tubs. And we're kind of in there and we're like messing around over clothing. And then we're, I'm like giving a blowjob, like underneath the water, actually, which is kind of fun and also hard to do. So it's not lasting that long. We're like playing with each other under the water.
00:55:01:20 - 00:55:18:23
Jack
And, so his shorts come all the way off and we're, like, fooling around and like, they like, beep the sensor to let you know, like your time you have, like, I don't know, five, ten minutes left and we're fooling around. And then all of a sudden, the jets stop like the hot tub is just like, off. And we're like, is this because we have to leave?
00:55:18:23 - 00:55:37:01
Jack
Like, what's happening and like, and he we're trying to find his shorts. I'm like, where's your shorts? He's like, oh my gosh. They like got sucked up into the thing. And that's why it stops where the whole hot tub stuff. And I'm panicked because like they have like a speaker in there. There's no like camera, but there's like a speaker to tell you, like you have this much time left and I'm like, oh my gosh, we need to get your shorts.
00:55:37:01 - 00:55:53:07
Jack
Like, what are we going to leave in? You can't be naked. Like, and I'm like, what are they going to see that the thing sucked up. But after that, he did end up getting them out. We were just, like, dying, laughing and embarrassed and that it was going to get stuck and broken. So he got them out and like, we got to get dressed.
00:55:53:07 - 00:56:02:22
Jack
I think we ended up having sex in the shower, like, because they have a shower to rinse off before they, like, came and got us out. But yeah, I was worried that we were going to get like kicked out of sushi place.
00:56:03:00 - 00:56:06:17
Luna
So fucking funny. Also like Hot Tub.
00:56:06:17 - 00:56:12:18
Luna
Fool around Dory is like kind of tell us at the next level. Like, like I was like, fooled.
00:56:12:18 - 00:56:16:21
Luna
Around for, like, warm up, but not not for like anything.
00:56:16:21 - 00:56:18:10
Luna
Really beyond that. So like you were.
00:56:18:10 - 00:56:20:08
Luna
I'm, explain.
00:56:20:08 - 00:56:25:18
Luna
To me this underwater blowjob. That sounds like a next level ninja skill.
00:56:25:20 - 00:56:34:18
Jack
I don't even I don't know how. It's like I have really good breath control, maybe from singing and also from, like, diving and yoga, I don't know, so.
00:56:34:19 - 00:56:35:02
Luna
I feel.
00:56:35:02 - 00:56:38:00
Jack
Like I can be, like, calm and relaxed underwater.
00:56:38:02 - 00:56:39:06
Luna
Wow.
00:56:39:08 - 00:56:46:15
Jack
You're just, like, sucking dick. I don't know, underwater. I mean, he went down on me underwater, too, so.
00:56:46:17 - 00:56:50:23
Luna
Whoa. Yeah. Me. Okay, I love it.
00:56:51:01 - 00:57:09:06
Luna
And this isn't in your new introduction, but I think that when I spoke to you recently, you said that, like, overall, the trajectory of the sex in your life is just going up and up and up will you talk about that? And or like why you think that is?
00:57:09:08 - 00:57:28:07
Jack
I don't know why it is. I mean, I hope it is like going to keep going up and up and maybe it's having better communication or the partners that I'm selecting, you know, having the ability to communicate and connect with. But I would have said, yeah, my last partner was like the best I've ever had in my life.
00:57:28:07 - 00:57:44:03
Jack
And, you know, my friends would say, tell you that the person before that would I would say the same thing that, oh my gosh, is the best sex I ever had in my life. I know that on average, as female bodied humans get older, they have better sex because they let go of like the performative nature. And we know more about our bodies and what we like or we don't like.
00:57:44:08 - 00:58:05:02
Jack
So I'm hoping it's just that trajectory. And it's not like a one off or a five off and like, I'm going to have a plummet. I am nervous. I will say, like now again, being single and having had experienced in this last partner I had was immediately off the bat like the first time was, you know, perfect.
00:58:05:02 - 00:58:14:13
Jack
So I'm sure it was, but excited and I don't know, I guess we'll have to see what what comes next. Okay.
00:58:14:15 - 00:58:20:07
Luna
What else is on your horizon in terms of things you want to experience and or explore?
00:58:20:09 - 00:58:48:07
Jack
I think I'm interested in more like dynamics with more people. I've always been interested in double penetration and have never had it like actually to like penis people. So I think that would be interesting. I also have like a, a couple friend that is interested in adding females, and I think it'd be nice to just have like a lot of female identifying people and one male like I'm interested in this like harum type feeling of like just a lot of freedom.
00:58:48:09 - 00:59:09:19
Jack
And so I'm hoping to be able to explore that. I also I'm just, I think hoping to maybe date more women, I've, you know, had sex with women and people identify as women. But I have had less relationships. And so when I got into my last relationship, I felt like a little sad that I had it, that it was a, like a male identifying person.
00:59:09:19 - 00:59:35:17
Jack
And I was like, oh, if this really lasts forever, like, I haven't dated that many women. I was a monogamous relationship. And so I'm hoping that maybe I'll have more opportunities. And just yeah, that and then just more kinky fun exploring. I'm interested. I don't know how it will go in terms of like, polyamory and, you know, ethical non-monogamy.
00:59:35:18 - 00:59:40:17
Jack
Yeah. I'm not really sure. I think I'm, I'm a little nervous, but I'm excited to.
00:59:40:23 - 01:00:13:15
Luna
Oh, I am so excited. I'm so excited to hear your reflection as a fellow thoughtful sex nerd who loves, like, it sounds like you love experiences in general, but also you're driven by a deep curiosity, which I relate to. So I'm curious to hear. Okay. And on that note, exploring new horizons with deep curiosity. You are using your curiosity to research now kink and autism or some sort of intersection.
01:00:13:17 - 01:00:31:23
Luna
And I just learned from reading the book magnificent Sex, that there are different types of research. So there is a type where you are testing a hypothesis, and then there's one, I think you pronounce it phenomenological, where you're looking at a phenomenon and learning more about that. How are you structuring your what do you call it? Exploration, your research, I guess just research.
01:00:31:23 - 01:00:32:18
Luna
How are you structuring.
01:00:32:18 - 01:00:33:16
Luna
Whatever you're doing?
01:00:33:18 - 01:00:39:17
Luna
What are you doing? What are you hoping to learn? And how can we get involved?
01:00:39:19 - 01:01:01:02
Jack
Yeah. No. So it's definitely going to follow that second approach. It's more of looking at a phenomena. And essentially it was coming from my starting, you know, they say jokingly me certain research. But as a kinky autistic person in the community, meeting a lot of other kinky autistic people and being like you, this is a huge overlap.
01:01:01:04 - 01:01:24:05
Jack
What's happening here? Why is this happening? And looking at the research that exists, or I should say, doesn't, that kind of talks about this. And so my research specifically is exploratory. It's qualitative, which means I'm doing interviews. So I'm meeting people who are identified both as kinky and autistic. Self-diagnosis is valid. It doesn't have to be a medical diagnosis.
01:01:24:05 - 01:01:50:13
Jack
And I'm really just having honestly beautiful, fun conversations like this where I'm getting to hear about people's experiences and what they enjoy about it, where they love it, how they got into it. And essentially what I'm hoping to do is one just bring validity to this experience that we don't talk about and produce research by autistic people with autistic people instead of on autistic people.
01:01:50:15 - 01:02:15:18
Jack
Yeah, it will hopefully produce something that people can see themselves reflected and talk about, like the benefits and the joys of being an autistic individual, because a lot of the research that's out there on all disabilities, but on autism is like, do autistic people have feelings and why autistic people can't have relationships? And, you know, it's a lot of like, Pathologizing really sad, outlook.
01:02:15:18 - 01:02:39:12
Jack
And so this is just so much fun and like, this is valid and this is why we do it. And we are, you know, loving and experiencing things just like everybody else. And so, yeah, it's really just been a joy, you know, dissertation is not fun, but it's this is really fun research. And it's just been a joy to meet and connect with other people.
01:02:39:14 - 01:02:42:01
Luna
Oh, that is so cool.
01:02:42:03 - 01:02:58:01
Luna
Okay, so we are including a link in the description below. If people want to get in touch with you and be a part of this so that they can, participate. Is there anything else you want to say about what it's been like to get your PhD in human sexuality? Like, that's.
01:02:58:01 - 01:03:00:00
Luna
So fucking cool.
01:03:00:02 - 01:03:02:19
Luna
But like, what is it like, maybe there's someone out there who's like.
01:03:02:21 - 01:03:03:20
Luna
Should I study sex?
01:03:03:20 - 01:03:05:18
Luna
Like, what's your experience been like?
01:03:05:20 - 01:03:08:22
Jack
I think nobody cares if you have a PhD. Definitely don't do.
01:03:08:22 - 01:03:09:01
Luna
It.
01:03:09:04 - 01:03:32:20
Jack
But if you just are, if you want to just be a total nerd about sex, I highly recommend it. It was probably the most challenging thing I've ever done in my life. Coursework. But I learned so much and I really do think that, like education and knowledge around that is a privilege. There are so many ways to educate yourself outside of academia because like academia.
01:03:32:20 - 01:03:56:01
Jack
But, it's really fun. And a lot of people who are like, oh, I didn't even know you could study that. And like, what good is that going to do for you? And, honestly, I'm not sure. Yeah, it's definitely not like make me a ton of money, but I really believe there is an important I think quality of life and sexuality is highly linked and we don't talk about this enough.
01:03:56:01 - 01:04:07:11
Jack
And so, you know, if we can continue to bring validity to the science and get more people on our side, I think if people were happier, healthier, sexier world, I think, like you used to say something like that and you're.
01:04:07:13 - 01:04:09:08
Luna
I still do.
01:04:09:10 - 01:04:22:19
Jack
You go I think I went into it just to prove something to myself, but it's become such a huge part of my identity and something I love so much. It's hard to capture it in, like, I guess, efficient words that are succinct.
01:04:23:00 - 01:04:50:03
Luna
It is, well, it's so big to have so many learnings and all types of learnings are valid. But I am in gratitude and admiration for you and your peers who are bringing academia to a subject that is often underfunded, you know, not really overlooked, not researched deeply enough, or if it is, it's in this very specific academic tone, or we're only looking at kind of the negatives or there's this very clear slant to it.
01:04:50:03 - 01:05:13:10
Luna
And it's like as much learning as I've done over the past seven years of like intense self-study, following my own curiosity that does not land on every person with as much validity as people who that don't put as much stock in things that come with degrees. Let's say that, you know, and so I always, I always am a champion for all of that.
01:05:13:10 - 01:05:22:02
Luna
If I have more time, I would totally be, just a learner all the livelong day. How much screen time did you spend so much time on screens for school?
01:05:22:02 - 01:05:27:11
Luna
Like, it must be so much time reading things on screens. I think that's what, like, has me like, I don't know if I'm going to.
01:05:27:14 - 01:05:29:10
Luna
Be on a screen. I want to talk to a person, you know?
01:05:29:11 - 01:05:46:22
Jack
Yeah, no, I've read people always ask me like, what's the last thing you read? And I'm like, outside of research, it's been a while. I'm not going to lie. I have read a lot of research. Yeah, I spend a lot of time on screens in my program was hybrid when I started, actually, it was all virtual because it's during the pandemic.
01:05:46:22 - 01:06:04:18
Jack
And then it went to hybrid. And so I had to actually go in-person to San Francisco because that's where my, school is at. And I flippin hate being on the computer a lot. I see the Apple thing would be like, you average 13 hours on the could. I'm sure it's like.
01:06:04:19 - 01:06:05:16
Luna
Dude, I've been there.
01:06:05:16 - 01:06:25:17
Luna
I've. And I know that I feel way less sexy when I'm on a screen all day long, you know? And then when I'm in the mode where I am on set taking pictures of people or in person, working with people one on one directly, like I am fueled up like a healthy creature, you know? So it's like it's it's tough because I, you know, I want us to all have access to learnings.
01:06:25:17 - 01:06:27:07
Luna
And I know screens are a great way to do.
01:06:27:07 - 01:06:29:09
Luna
That, but then there's a trade off.
01:06:29:11 - 01:06:40:00
Luna
What's your timeline like for for this like for finishing your research, finishing your program. Like how how long until you get to read a book for fun?
01:06:40:02 - 01:07:05:14
Jack
I'm hoping latest I will be graduated next year, so May 2026. But depending on how again, I'm researching, I'm doing interviews with people. I have to start writing up. Maybe I could graduate this year. I really don't know. I'm trying to give myself the the buffer. So it depends on how quickly I can meet with people and feel like I'm seeing something that's worth saying.
01:07:05:14 - 01:07:23:11
Jack
And also, I'm giving an opportunity for my participants to read what I'm writing and make sure they agree and be a part of that process. And so if they want, there's no pressure. You know, really just want there's a I think there's a fine line for researchers or people who are doing their dissertation specifically, like, you can't do everything.
01:07:23:11 - 01:07:41:00
Jack
So, you know, I'm 20, decide how to keep it small so I can graduate and be okay, that this is really the first step. And I can go through and do all these other research, like the more exploring that I want to do, the other things that are coming up afterwards. So I'm hoping. Graduate latest May 2026.
01:07:41:00 - 01:07:41:06
Luna
I.
01:07:41:06 - 01:08:02:13
Luna
Love that. Well, I have a new favorite song that I wrote myself. It's very short. I'll sing it for you one step at a time, one step at a time. And you can rewrite that as much as you need to if inserting different words. But, I love that you're working on it. I am so extremely excited to see how your research unfolds and what you discover and where you focus it.
01:08:02:13 - 01:08:13:02
Luna
And, you know, that's just one leaping off point for the big, wide, sexy future. So thank you for coming back and sharing your sexy updates.
01:08:13:04 - 01:08:14:21
Jack
Well, thank you so much. This is so great.
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