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267 | Orgy Dome Daddy: Lazlo on Woo


Cis white male in a 19 year monogamous relationship, shares how he went from rockstar to porn lawyer and group Daddy of Orgy Dome, a staple of Burning Man for 20+ years run by and then there’s only LOVE.


🔗 LAZLO LINKS | @allangelbard / @xxxesq / fetlife



00:00:00:00 - 00:00:18:08

Luna

And our guest today is a cisgendered, self-described old white guy who is in a 19 year relationship with his wife that is open. He is into protecting sexual rights, porn copyrights and trademarks, as well as alt lifestyle clubs and groups. Burning man. He's a camp lead of And Then There's Only Love and their gift is the Orgy Dome.


00:00:18:10 - 00:00:33:21

Luna

Electronic music production and deejaying, skiing and scuba diving. Born and raised in Los Angeles, he is a First Amendment intellectual property and entertainment law attorney. He is my lawyer, working predominantly in the adult entertainment and alt lifestyle spaces. Welcome. Should I say your whole name or Helen Gilmore?


00:00:33:23 - 00:00:35:21

Lazlo

That's me or Lazlo, whichever you prefer.


00:00:35:21 - 00:00:37:17

Luna

Okay. Lazlo. Welcome.


00:00:37:19 - 00:00:38:21

Lazlo

Hi.


00:00:38:23 - 00:00:40:10

Luna

I'm so happy to have you here.


00:00:40:12 - 00:00:41:03

Lazlo

Pleasure to be here.


00:00:41:05 - 00:00:51:05

Luna

Could you start off by telling us if you had to rate yourself on a sexual shame meter, with ten being the most full of shame possible and zero being like, what is your dream? Where do you fall today?


00:00:51:06 - 00:00:52:19

Lazlo

0.005.


00:00:53:01 - 00:00:57:15

Luna

Okay. When if ever, does it fluctuate? And have you had a shame of coaster throughout your lifetime?


00:00:57:17 - 00:01:19:06

Lazlo

Well, I mean, I, I got dragged into all lifestyle stuff in the early 80s by a girlfriend. I was I was raised in a relatively conservative household. And so the idea of, like, having multiple partners and group sex and all of those things were completely foreign to me. And then a girlfriend dragged me into it, and I was kind of very hesitant initially.


00:01:19:06 - 00:01:37:03

Lazlo

I mean, you know, like a little devil on one side and little angel on the other side going, yeah, I'll do it. No, don't do it. It was a couple of weeks of sort of gentle and then a big shove, and it just went downhill from there. Uphill from there. And I really don't have the concept of sexual shame in my world.


00:01:37:03 - 00:01:57:02

Lazlo

I'm. There are times I feel like I've represented people that maybe I shouldn't have. Because they're maybe not deserving of my respect. I've had friends that have turned out to be less than what I thought they were. So that's not I'm not sure that's really, that doesn't really count as shame. But you know, I'm certainly not a zero.


00:01:57:05 - 00:02:04:02

Lazlo

I don't think anybody that is, anything other than a sociopath is a zero. But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.


00:02:04:04 - 00:02:12:03

Luna

Yeah. I mean, I think it's context to. Right. Like, do you squiggle up and down in circumstance? Like, do you ever find yourself in circumstances where you're like, oh shit. Because I still do sometimes.


00:02:12:03 - 00:02:31:09

Lazlo

Yeah. I mean, there are times where I'll be in an environment and I see something going on that I don't think is kosher. And I don't know enough about what's actually happening to intercede. So there's that momentary like do I do something. Do I not do something. Do I say something. Do I just stand back and watch, you know, those kinds of thing happen.


00:02:31:09 - 00:02:42:16

Lazlo

But as a, as a community lead and as sort of like the group daddy, for lack of a better term, I take my responsibility to my community seriously. And if I see something that really looks problematic, I'll try and fix it.


00:02:42:18 - 00:03:00:12

Luna

I love that. I was just at Kink Fest in Portland this past weekend, and I was like, watching the dungeon monitors watch people. And I was like, you know, I love to have a job when I'm somewhere because I like structure, I like clear rules. I like all of that. And I was just like, it feels like such a responsibility, though, because to go to what you're saying, like, how would you know?


00:03:00:12 - 00:03:02:21

Luna

And I know that's also what you guys kind of train people to do when.


00:03:02:21 - 00:03:12:22

Lazlo

We do train. And, you know, Orgy Dome has been doing this for this will be our 20th year at Burning Man. It hasn't been what it is now for 20 years. I mean, it started out as a joke, but,


00:03:13:00 - 00:03:13:18

Luna

One actual joke.


00:03:13:18 - 00:03:32:02

Lazlo

An actual joke. Really? Yeah. The origin of Orgy Dome was a joke. The founder of our camp was a porn performer named Jennifer Steele, and I. I can say her name because everybody, she's very about this. She was a porn performer and a featured dancer, and she and her husband, then husband, were sharing an RV with another couple.


00:03:32:04 - 00:03:46:21

Lazlo

And when they came to renting the RV, it was like, you know, we're sexy people. We have sex a lot is not going to be a problem for the others. And they're like, oh, no, it's not a big deal. Well, that's not a big deal for most civilians. But, you know, sex professionals have a lot them a lot more.


00:03:46:22 - 00:04:06:14

Lazlo

When they say we have a lot of sex, they mean something different. Yeah. Than what? You know, civilians say. Anyway, long story short, very long story, sort of short. Michael, Jennifer's husband had a, like, a little pup tent with them that they were going to be storing costumes and things like that. And the other couple was getting offended that there was so much sex going on.


00:04:06:17 - 00:04:21:21

Lazlo

So Michael set the little tent up outside behind the motorhome with a little blow up air mattress in it, and by sheer chance, he found this piece of cardboard and wrote Orgy Dome on it and stuck it on the outside of the tent. And, you know, they'd be out there goofing off in it, but they left for the burn.


00:04:21:21 - 00:04:40:10

Lazlo

And then they came back after Burn Night, and there were three other couples fucking in it. And Jennifer went, I've got an idea. And that's that was the origin of orgy. Don't act. So they bought a little like circus, like a little tiny ten foot across circus tent. And for the first few years, it was basically just an unregulated play space.


00:04:40:12 - 00:05:01:23

Lazlo

And that got messy. And then a couple joined and a bunch of other people joined that were instructors or had professional expertise in, you know, teaching people about sexuality. And we decided it would be a teachable moment. So Orgy Dome has become a consent school, for lack of a better term. And we're a 583. We're consensual reality.


00:05:02:01 - 00:05:18:05

Lazlo

523 California nonprofit, educational based. And we, you know, we do it at Burning Man. We also like, do consent talks at Play Spaces. We're hoping to sort of take the show on the road next year by a small truck and go do little versions of Orgy Dome at the various regionals and things like that.


00:05:18:07 - 00:05:26:17

Luna

That's awesome. Thank you. Wait, have I even told you that my big, big dream is to have a mobile dungeon and just go around and, like, interview people and make spaces for people.


00:05:26:17 - 00:05:29:10

Lazlo

To fuck you? You can do that. I mean, you know what?


00:05:29:12 - 00:05:42:23

Luna

I love that, so, okay, I would love to hear if you could encapsulate it in an answer. How are you making the world a sexier, more loving place? And like, when did you also get involved or orgy Joan? But like, how did you get to where you are today with all the sexy things you do.


00:05:43:01 - 00:06:04:08

Lazlo

Trip, stumble, fall, being open to possibilities? I mean, my first sort of experience with open sexuality, for lack of a better term, was when I was on the road with rock and roll bands and, you know, there's groupies everywhere, and that was fun. But I had a partner that I loved, and when I came home, I had cheated on her and she found out and your relationship exploded.


00:06:04:10 - 00:06:25:16

Lazlo

So, I was a bit messed up for a while. And then, as I was saying, a number of years later, I met this woman who convinced me that consensual non-monogamy was a good thing. And I have taken that to heart in a very serious way. I don't want to say I teach it, I probably preach it. And when people ask me about it, I'm very open about it.


00:06:25:16 - 00:06:46:09

Lazlo

I, you know, I'm respectful of my partner's privacy. I'm respectful of my friend's privacy. Like, for example, one of the rules of Orgy Dome is we don't talk about who comes to Orgy Dome because a lot of well known people come to orgy. Don't people go to Burning Man? And that's a bucket list thing for them. And then the Orgy Dome is another bucket list thing for them, and they don't want to get outed.


00:06:46:09 - 00:07:08:16

Lazlo

So we don't allow cameras or cell phones or things like that. In fact, we have a sledge hammer named Thor. And if we see a camera or cell phone in a structure, we smash it. But, you know, we're we're very cautious about people being able to dip their toe into this kind of thing for the first time and having a safe environment, a clean environment, a relatively dust free environment, and know that their picture isn't going to end up on Facebook on Monday morning, you know.


00:07:08:20 - 00:07:20:15

Lazlo

Yeah. So that's how I make the world a better place. And I also, you know, represent a lot of alternative lifestyle groups when clubs, porn companies, things like that. Yeah, yeah.


00:07:20:17 - 00:07:22:18

Luna

Okay. Oh there's like so many there's a.


00:07:22:18 - 00:07:24:10

Lazlo

Lot of shit. There's a book in there somewhere.


00:07:24:10 - 00:07:29:06

Luna

I was going to say. Yeah. Okay. So wait, when did you get involved with Orgy Dome specifically?


00:07:29:06 - 00:07:50:00

Lazlo

I started with Orgy Dome in 2006. I've been burning since 2000. My first year, I just went with a friend, sort of spur of the moment. And the next year we joined, a performance troupe called The Mutator, which was a big thing out there for a few years. And it, it, it exploded in the most horrible way in 2005.


00:07:50:00 - 00:08:03:06

Lazlo

And Jennifer asked me to join Orgy Dome. At that point, she'd known me because she was a mutator fan and also knew me through the adult entertainment law stuff that I do. So I joined the camp then and and there ever since. That's awesome.


00:08:03:07 - 00:08:14:00

Luna

What are your favorite parts? Well, okay, two part question what do you like the most about sex? And then what do you like the most about like orgy Tom, Burning Man like that specific flavor.


00:08:14:03 - 00:08:35:05

Lazlo

Those are such different questions. I mean, sex is different things at different times. Sometimes it's like emotional support. Sometimes it's just pure pleasure. Sometimes it's power exchange. I mean, there's something about grabbing a girl by the hair or the back of her neck and staring in her eyes, and that's hot. You know, the the orgy dome thing is different.


00:08:35:05 - 00:08:57:15

Lazlo

Orgy dome is about teaching people that they can be sexually social, responsibly, and that it doesn't ruin their marriage if they play in rooms with other people or if they play with other people. It's about it's a matter of negotiating and explaining how to do this ethically and morally and safely. And those are completely different things. I very seldom get to actually play in the orgy.


00:08:57:15 - 00:09:01:09

Lazlo

Don't really busy running it to play in it, although I can't say never.


00:09:01:15 - 00:09:11:03

Luna

Okay, okay, okay. Do you, Dan. Okay, this is where my brain goes in five directions and I have to pick one. So you never get to play or you rarely get to play.


00:09:11:04 - 00:09:28:13

Lazlo

I didn't say never. You don't get to play it. There have been years where I didn't play in there at all. Last year was better. I was in there three times four times during the I mean, we're there. I'm there for almost three weeks. Yeah. I'm there a week before to build, and then I'm there for the whole week, and then it's a couple of days after to tear it all down.


00:09:28:15 - 00:09:49:01

Lazlo

But, I mean, the actual structure itself is open to the public from Monday at 2 p.m. until the following Sunday at 6 a.m. when we close. So we're open for a week. And I was in there every couple of days. But then it rained and I lost Friday and Saturday. So yeah, last year was weird. I heard I was batshit, it was one of my best burns ever.


00:09:49:02 - 00:09:50:06

Lazlo

Okay, it really was.


00:09:50:08 - 00:10:00:01

Luna

But what does it take for you to either feel drawn to connect with a new partner sexually, or like safe enough to, you know, it's because you are a community leader and have all this responsibility?


00:10:00:05 - 00:10:20:09

Lazlo

Those are also two real different questions. I mean, I'm I'm I'm a daddy. Domino. Sapien sexual. So those two things are my attractive thing. I mean, someone has to be good looking, but that's not enough. And somebody has to be smart. But that's not enough. They're they've got to be in the right headspace to deal with a guy like me, which is not an easy thing to do.


00:10:20:11 - 00:10:42:02

Lazlo

I get it. And I'm, I'm very careful about, the power dynamic situation. And I do this in my community as well. I'm well known. I'm a community lead. I'm a associated with a number of different communities. And so when I'm in those spaces, I don't hit on people. Our running gag at Orgy Dome is your camp leads your vampires.


00:10:42:02 - 00:11:04:12

Lazlo

You have to ask us in. We don't respond to verbal cues. Unless you, like, verbally ask me to play with you. I'm not going to hit on you. And that's just that way. There's never a question whether somebody was intimidated into doing something with me that they wouldn't have otherwise done. I look, I can't tell you everybody in the world knows it that way, but I do.


00:11:04:14 - 00:11:19:23

Lazlo

And that way if something comes up, if somebody makes an accusation, enough people know me and have been around me for long enough, or they'll know that's not Laszlo. He doesn't work that way. Okay, so I'm I'm very comfortable acting the way I do and ethically the way I do.


00:11:20:01 - 00:11:25:07

Luna

Could you outline for us some of the health and safety standards for anyone who might want to attend, or are you done?


00:11:25:12 - 00:11:53:05

Lazlo

Well, we provide condoms and lube and towels and puppy pads, and we have touchless lube dispensers and things like that. Part of our orientation speech is asking people to disclose with their partners any STIs they may have, because our consent mechanism requires informed, enthusiastic consent and you're not informed about something. If you don't know about it. So if you have an STI that you are putting a partner at potential risk, even it's a tiny, tiny, tiny, tiny risk.


00:11:53:05 - 00:12:16:23

Lazlo

You know, it's not right to not tell your partner about that before you play with them. So that's one of the things we do. But we also have, you know, we have don't masters, you have to go through a whole line of people to get into the play space. You have to you you start with our streetwalkers where they answer some questions, they check your ID to make sure you've got a proper government ID in you're 18 years of age or older, and we check it again later.


00:12:17:03 - 00:12:34:12

Lazlo

You got to be sober enough to give consent or understand when someone's asking you for consent, because Burning Man is a place where people play with pharmacology. Yeah. And we don't let people like that in. And then they go through the orientation, which varies depending on who's giving it. Then they're in the Aphrodite's Garden space and we keep an eye on them there.


00:12:34:12 - 00:12:51:10

Lazlo

So if they're looking like Uber nervous or if they, if there's a lot of head shaking going on, we ask them to, you know, come back when they're more in tune to doing what they want to do. We want people to negotiate their scenes before they get into the space itself. So there isn't a lot of renegotiation and people screaming red all the time.


00:12:51:15 - 00:13:05:12

Lazlo

Yeah. And then they go into the space and the, the area is divided into two sections. One is called just us and the other is open to more. If you come with a partner and you only want to play with that partner and you don't want anybody else coming over and touching you, we're asking you to play.


00:13:05:18 - 00:13:20:23

Lazlo

You go into just a section and you know, you can look around and you can see the other things that are going on around you, but you can't like, stop and watch other people call that perving. And you need consent for that. So you can do that on the open to more side. Open to more does not mean come on over and grab a handful.


00:13:20:23 - 00:13:44:08

Lazlo

Open to more means come over and ask if you can play and then negotiate a scene. And that's all good. There's only two spaces in the structure that don't require consent for watching. We have two raised pedestal beds at the far end of open. The more we call those are exhibitionist beds. So if you're on one of those two large raised beds, people can be on these little benches around you and watch without asking.


00:13:44:10 - 00:13:47:09

Lazlo

They can't touch, but they can watch. Okay, okay.


00:13:47:11 - 00:13:48:15

Luna

The beds are hot. We are.


00:13:48:15 - 00:13:51:14

Lazlo

The beds are raised up off the ground. They're about four feet off of the benches below.


00:13:51:14 - 00:13:52:18

Luna

Are they in the same area?


00:13:52:21 - 00:14:01:02

Lazlo

They're, you know, benches are about the size of this couch and the beds are about like that tall. And you can play on the couches while you're watching the couples on the beds. It's very nicely designed.


00:14:01:03 - 00:14:09:02

Luna

That's nice. I also have so many dreams about, like up above catwalks for watchers. So you can just like, look down and see everything. I have so many fantasies about that.


00:14:09:02 - 00:14:35:11

Lazlo

Well, one of the interesting things about Orgy Dome is it's not a dome, but Orgy Dome sounds a whole lot better than orgy, a series of interconnected carports. And we're trademarked. So we did that where we are in constant talks about can we build a real dome? And to build one large enough to do what we want to do, where there would be catwalks and multiple layers and the air conditioning that would be required to do that is over 400 grand.


00:14:35:13 - 00:14:38:02

Luna

And you would I would want it to be a permanent structure.


00:14:38:02 - 00:14:56:15

Lazlo

That I'm like, you don't think it's too much trouble to build it and tear it down and put it somewhere? It's a lot. I mean, it's a lot of work to build what we build. Yeah, and to do that, we'd need cranes and all sorts of crazy stuff. And it's not that it's impossible. I just if I had 400,000 to spend, I'd rather do it on outreach than, than just a bigger place to play.


00:14:56:15 - 00:15:04:22

Luna

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I hear that. I love the, the rule or the rules that are set in place are so explicit.


00:15:05:00 - 00:15:05:09

Lazlo

Yeah, but.


00:15:05:09 - 00:15:19:04

Luna

It also sounds like there is room for not for anyone who's in a leadership role, but there is still some sort of like, flirty, you know, I'm, I'm trying to always figure out flirts. Right. And how they fit into spaces. So it sounds like maybe there's an encouragement for explicitness, but room for flirting.


00:15:19:04 - 00:15:43:12

Lazlo

In our space. We do not condone watching verbal cues unless you're with a partner that you already know. Okay, like if I'm in there with my wife and she wants to do something, she doesn't have to tell me to do it, she can point and I'll know what she's thinking about. Right? But if you're playing with somebody that you don't know or if you're in an unusual environment, we want verbal cues because we people will misread nonverbal cues, and we're not clairvoyant.


00:15:43:14 - 00:16:01:20

Lazlo

And I would rather people not have the experience and not have the problem. You know, and they can always go have the experience later. If they talk about it, then have the experience and have a problem. And now it's an issue. Yeah. Yeah. You know, it's it's really important to me that this is most people's first time doing something like this.


00:16:01:22 - 00:16:17:10

Lazlo

And like many other things in your world, like if the first time you go scuba diving, you almost drown, you probably won't go scuba diving again. If the first time you go into a sexually social space, you have a really bad experience, somebody grabs you. Somebody does something that makes you uncomfortable. That's how that imprints on your head, and you don't go back.


00:16:17:16 - 00:16:19:10

Lazlo

And we want people to come back. Yeah, yeah.


00:16:19:10 - 00:16:34:19

Luna

So do I feel that I've every place place I've been to so far. There's just a lot of like neurotypical sort of like And I'm like But it's like I really need words. So I love spaces that are like clearly held and have that.


00:16:34:22 - 00:16:50:09

Lazlo

Yeah. You know, one of my favorite comedians was a guy named Sam Kinison who died a lot of years ago. But he had this like lovely rant about, just tell me what you what, you know. So that's how we run the thing. You know, if you if you say, I want to do X and the other person says, fuck yeah, then you're going to do X, yeah.


00:16:50:10 - 00:17:03:17

Lazlo

Doesn't mean you're going to do Y. Yeah. You know, it doesn't mean you're going to ask to do Y while you're doing X. That's what we're going to do. Yeah. You know. Yeah. Yeah. And the other thing, one of the other things that we say is no is not the beginning of a negotiation. No is the end of the discussion.


00:17:03:19 - 00:17:17:01

Lazlo

So if I say to you do you want to do X and you're like no thank you, I don't get to go. Well how about Y. How about Z. I don't get to badger you until I finally say something that you're willing to do to shut me up. Right. You know what I mean. Right. So if I say would you like to do X?


00:17:17:01 - 00:17:25:09

Lazlo

And you're like, no, thank you, that's it. If you say, I'd rather not, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't I? Why don't we try y okay. Now it comes back to me.


00:17:25:09 - 00:17:26:02

Luna

For the conversation.


00:17:26:02 - 00:17:30:23

Lazlo

And now it's a conversation. Right? But no is the end of the discussion on either side.


00:17:31:01 - 00:17:42:23

Luna

Which is so opposite of so many of the signals that we're taught through media. Think Han Solo, Princess Leia. There's a lot of pushing. And then, you know, even in sales tactics, they're like, no, is the beginning of getting more information right? I love that it.


00:17:43:01 - 00:18:07:19

Lazlo

Was an opportunity to sell. Oh, no, it is not. I know when I started in play spaces, the sort of general rule was anything other than a no is a yes. I mean, you know, my first experiences in sex parties, for lack of a better term, you know, swingers parties were, you know, big house parties or hotel takeovers where you just walk over and grab someone by the waist, and if they didn't want to play with you, they sort of pushed you away.


00:18:07:22 - 00:18:16:04

Lazlo

Oh, dang. And that's not a good way to do this. I didn't know any better than I was in my late 20s and early 30s, and that's just how people did things.


00:18:16:05 - 00:18:18:10

Luna

It is the culture of a lot of those types of spaces.


00:18:18:10 - 00:18:33:11

Lazlo

And it's interesting because a lot of the, the I use the word kids, and I don't mean it pejoratively, I'm much older than most of the people in my play groups. They look at the word swinger as a negative. They don't understand that they came from that, you know. Yes.


00:18:33:12 - 00:18:51:01

Luna

I'm I'm guilty of that sometimes. But I also have had some I mean, now I have interviewed enough swingers and gotten to know a little bit more about the different kind of parts of those community. But I also had people who identified as swingers who didn't want to use protection, who push back when I wanted to, you know, and who were like very, very rude about it and then just grabby.


00:18:51:01 - 00:18:53:08

Luna

So like, yeah, I get that, you.


00:18:53:08 - 00:19:10:04

Lazlo

Know, we we are strong supporters of protection. We provide it. You know, if you look, we're not your mom. If you don't want to use protection, don't use protection. That's up to you. Yeah. But if you if you don't use protection with somebody you don't know, as my mom used to say, if you fall out of that tree and break your leg, don't come running to me.


00:19:10:04 - 00:19:35:11

Lazlo

Yeah. You know, totally. You have to be intelligent about these things. And that's part of our consent talk as well, which is we strongly encourage using protection. We strongly encourage, you know, disclosing STIs, all of those things that the safety elements of what we do, we can only do the best we can. And I can't tell you that no one's ever, you know, had a bad experience and or, you know, but it's an incredibly small number, an incredibly.


00:19:35:11 - 00:19:43:00

Luna

Small amount. I love that. So if I just keep thinking about the idea of you being a vampire, not an energy vampire, but the.


00:19:43:00 - 00:19:49:23

Lazlo

Kind of show I love, the show. My wife's favorite show, Cullen Robinson.


00:19:50:01 - 00:20:06:23

Luna

But just like I'm the same way in my regular life, I'm like, if you want to play, there needs to be explicit words. Yeah, it is funny to me that other things are the norm. Like that is very difficult for my brain. I would love to hear you. You've given us some snippets, but maybe fill in gaps. How did you learn about sex?


00:20:06:23 - 00:20:09:18

Luna

Maybe start at the very beginning, like you've clearly.


00:20:09:18 - 00:20:11:02

Lazlo

Been to things you know a lot.


00:20:11:02 - 00:20:11:19

Luna

Of experience.


00:20:11:19 - 00:20:18:00

Lazlo

But how did I learn about it? I mean, I vaguely recall Playboy magazines and what am I, uncle's closet?


00:20:18:00 - 00:20:19:01

Luna

Was that like your first exposure?


00:20:19:01 - 00:20:37:10

Lazlo

I think it may I look, I'm 66. I can't remember what I had for lunch yesterday, so, I told you there I have moments, There are times I can't believe I'm not 30. And then there are times I can't believe I'm 100. I remember, like, my first experience trying to have sex with a girl that I met.


00:20:37:12 - 00:20:52:20

Lazlo

I was an electric guitar player. I couldn't I started out on the violin and I couldn't pick up girls with a violin. So I picked up the electric guitar. And my band was playing at a place in the in the valley called the Teen Center. And I met this girl, and she wanted me to come over to her babysitting job.


00:20:52:20 - 00:21:05:11

Lazlo

And I went over there and the parents came home so we couldn't do it. And then the next week it's like, well, we're just going to go and we're going to rent an apartment or rent a motel somewhere. No one will rent a motel to a 15 year old. So then the next weekend, I was like, well, we're going to, you know, we're going to go here.


00:21:05:12 - 00:21:26:01

Lazlo

And I mean, for like 3 or 4 weekends. And then my car broke down one time and we finally we ended up in Tapir Park in Malibu Canyon, in the backseat of my father's Peugeot, in the middle of a Boy Scout jamboree. And the sex lasted about 15 seconds. Okay, because I was 15 and really wanted to do that.


00:21:26:03 - 00:21:41:04

Lazlo

And, you know, it was probably not the greatest thing for her, but she'd already done it. I was a virgin. So, we did that a few times and then a number of years. Well not years, a number of months later I met a woman who was significantly older than I was. I did something nice for her.


00:21:41:04 - 00:21:55:14

Lazlo

And I'm not going to go into the specifics, but I did something nice for her with no intention of getting any sort of payback. And we ended up in a, in a relationship where it's like, you want to learn about sex. I want to have sex with you. I'll teach you. You just have to. You just have to follow my lead.


00:21:55:14 - 00:22:11:22

Lazlo

I'm like, okay, I love that. So, you know, I had I had an instructor for six months and when I was 17, and it was great because she was significantly older. And so we'd go out like we'd go to the Sunset Strip and stuff, and the guys like the door guys would check her ID and she's like 27.


00:22:11:22 - 00:22:17:18

Lazlo

Okay, well, he's got to be old enough and they just let me in. So I was hanging out in Hollywood, you know, in my late teens and early 20s.


00:22:17:18 - 00:22:18:00

Luna

Like,


00:22:18:06 - 00:22:20:03

Lazlo

Before I was even playing their first film.


00:22:20:08 - 00:22:36:05

Luna

Wow. Dang. Weird. So then you. Oh, my gosh, there's a thousand. Also, it's also one of my other big fantasies. I know this is not doesn't fit anywhere in our laws, but like, I'm like, I just want a sex camp. Like for grown ups in the, you know, in the Netherlands they have the teaching, like the camp for kids in the summer.


00:22:36:07 - 00:22:42:23

Luna

It's not a sex camp specific, but they do like sex scene stuff. There. And I'm like, I want that for grown ups. Like I want a proper one where there's like facilitators.


00:22:42:23 - 00:22:47:22

Lazlo

Read Morocco does, Sex Geek or whatever it's called. He's got a thing.


00:22:48:00 - 00:22:51:08

Luna

Like, I want the counselors to be like counselors.


00:22:51:10 - 00:22:57:16

Lazlo

Well, I mean, if you're talking about, like, more of a fantasy counselor thing, like, that's a different story. I just wish I was family camp.


00:22:57:16 - 00:23:04:09

Luna

I wish I could mix a brothel with a camp. So that people could learn and play and have, like, professionals mixed in with their.


00:23:04:09 - 00:23:16:20

Lazlo

Yeah, you probably could do that in the right locations. I don't think you can do it in California, because if you're charging money, no, not gravitation, that's prostitution. But in certain counties in Nevada, you could do something like that.


00:23:16:21 - 00:23:21:16

Luna

Maybe they there's no new brothel licenses. You'd have to take one over. And I'm not sure what I've heard.


00:23:21:16 - 00:23:28:10

Lazlo

You need a brothel license to do a camp, but I'm not licensed in Nevada, so don't listen to anything I say. I don't know.


00:23:28:12 - 00:23:43:08

Luna

What else in your pleasure timeline. Your formative pleasure timeline feels relevant to share or like. What would you like? Like what was important to you growing as a sexual being? You had like an instructor, a literal instructor, and then you were a rock star?


00:23:43:10 - 00:23:54:12

Lazlo

Yeah, I went from like rock star to porn lawyer and there was a weird time middle in there. I, I was, look, I'm sort of what I call an equal opportunity pervert when it comes to partners.


00:23:54:14 - 00:23:55:06

Luna

Like, what does that mean?


00:23:55:06 - 00:24:18:06

Lazlo

I love that I like, I mean, being like, I'm tall and short. I'm not real big on heavy, but, you know, nothing short of a like. And it's nothing wrong with being happy. If that's your thing, that's great. Not my ideal. But, I mean, I've played with kink stories, I've played with serial monogamist, I've played with the whole gamut of sexually aware beings and I never said, ooh, that's not for me, other than the CNC thing.


00:24:18:06 - 00:24:34:19

Lazlo

That's not for me. And that's just because I'm more of a daddy domme than a hardcore like, and you head underwater kind of guy, totally. But I mean, if you want to get tied up. I was a Boy scout. I learned to tie knots, and so that was helpful. And all of the things that I've developed in my life have always influenced my sexuality.


00:24:34:19 - 00:24:50:13

Lazlo

One way or the other. You know, it's like, I love scuba. So it's I went, hey, let's see if we can fuck in the bottom swimming pool. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Oh, there's very few things in the world sexually that I haven't done. I filmed underwater porn.


00:24:50:13 - 00:24:56:05

Luna

Tell us about that. You're the first person I've talked to who has. And I have someone who writes me a lot and asks me about.


00:24:56:05 - 00:25:12:10

Lazlo

Hey, I came from the music business to the porn industry to law. And while I was in the porn industry, I was the second cameraman and editor for a porn producer named Seymour Butz. And we shot him. We shot a bunch of movies. I think I did 40 something movies with a guy over the course of a few years.


00:25:12:10 - 00:25:32:19

Lazlo

But, we did a show called A Pool Party at Seymour's, which was a two VHS tapes, a two tape movie, and it got nominated for HBO and stuff. But there were a bunch of I mean, it was a backyard pool party, and I was in the bottom of the pool of my underwater video camera in a wetsuit, you know, filming, that was kind of fun.


00:25:32:21 - 00:25:42:12

Lazlo

But, I mean, I've shot shark footage, too, so it's kind of the same. Only different. There most scary in different sorts of ways. That's so cool on this one.


00:25:42:15 - 00:25:53:12

Luna

So like, so there's like, because, like, water fucking is hard anyway. Yeah. And so underwater fucking and you have a camera like that to keep the heart on that. Is it sticky? Like, how do they I.


00:25:53:14 - 00:26:07:20

Lazlo

I don't have I mean I've played in water, but silicone lube, you know. Okay. You don't want to use water based lube in swing because it goes away real fast. You, but, I mean, they were these are professionals. And, you know, I'm not going to name names. If you really want to see the movie, go rent them more.


00:26:07:22 - 00:26:31:09

Lazlo

I'm sure it's online party minutes. Yeah, we did a bunch of really fun stuff. He had a partner named Shane who was a real firecracker, and Shane and her girlfriend, who I won't name, were walking through New York one day, walked into a firehouse and ended up fucking a fireman on a fire truck. And it was it created all sorts of national stir and.


00:26:31:10 - 00:26:45:03

Lazlo

Oh, really? Oh, I was they fired the guy. I mean, obviously, I mean, we got, you know, we got cease and desist letters from the city of New York and you can't show that. And I'm like, yeah, we can. I'm a law student and I know the First Amendment. And we got Molly releases, you know? Really? Yeah.


00:26:45:03 - 00:26:45:20

Lazlo

I mean, what.


00:26:45:20 - 00:26:47:12

Luna

About the location release?


00:26:47:13 - 00:26:51:02

Lazlo

But yeah, it's a public private property. Our house is public property, but.


00:26:51:03 - 00:26:53:07

Luna

You can't fuck everywhere in public. But it was inside.


00:26:53:07 - 00:27:08:08

Lazlo

It was indoors. And all the other firemen are standing around watching. You know, it's not like they didn't do anything in secret. Okay? This was a long time ago in a galaxy. Okay. But that made some really great footage. Yeah, I've seen some shit.


00:27:08:10 - 00:27:14:08

Luna

Okay. What are your other turn ons and turn off? Like, what else are you into? How long have you been a daddy Dawn? Like, specifically, what really makes me.


00:27:14:08 - 00:27:30:09

Lazlo

Excited, I think. I mean, I've always been a bit of a facilitator. I've had girlfriends that had, like, particular things they like to do and their prior boyfriends like, ooh, that's gross. I would never. And so my response is, you really want to do that? Well, let's figure out how we can do that safely and I'll make that happen for you.


00:27:30:11 - 00:27:54:10

Lazlo

And I guess that's probably why I keep having this great line of girlfriends. Although I've been with my wife for 19 years, I've always been open to the idea of making shit happen for other people. I like that there's something rewarding for me about that. And so when I when I'm exposed to something like, for example, rope bondage, I obviously I learn to tie knots and Boy Scouts and there was some understanding of that.


00:27:54:10 - 00:28:11:18

Lazlo

But as I got older and as I had partners that we're more into, that's like, oh no, no, no, this is how you have to do it. You know, now I represent one of the biggest S&M manufacturers in the world. I'm not going to name them. And I've gotten pretty good with rope, and I've gotten pretty good with cuffs, and I know how to immobilize somebody if that's what they want.


00:28:11:18 - 00:28:32:22

Lazlo

But these things require pre-planning and, you know, consent and all of that stuff. So like anything else in my world, I want somebody to feel safe. And if they want to play with me in a way like that, they need to know that it's going to be okay. And if they say, stop, I'm going to stop. And my current favorite safe word is meatloaf.


00:28:33:00 - 00:28:49:22

Lazlo

Oh, wait, why? You remember, you remember the big heavyset, singer meatloaf. Oh, yeah. And the Rocky Horror Picture Show actor. He has a song. It's called I'll Do Anything for love, but I won't do that. Okay. Meatloaf is my favorite current safe word because it doesn't get confused for other things. You yell meatloaf in a crowded room and people go, what?


00:28:50:00 - 00:28:54:08

Lazlo

Yeah. You know. Yeah. So I mean, read works, but I like meatloaf.


00:28:54:10 - 00:29:25:17

Luna

And I was just learning about rock stuff. And there is so much like as a potential rock bottom, I mean, I'm learning to time I not I know a single column, I know a double column. But the thing that makes me so nervous to be in top space ever is in something with something as intense as that. It's like being responsible for possible nerve damage, being responsible for, I mean, in theory, the communication and, you know, having people who maybe don't know how to read their own bodies, how do you kind of like select for the bottoms or submissives that you're playing with to make sure you are safe for?


00:29:25:18 - 00:29:44:18

Lazlo

For starters, I very seldom play with anybody that's new. Okay. Partially for my own protection. I don't claim to be an expert by any stretch of the imagination. I mean, I'm I'm schooled on a 1 to 10. I'm probably a good, strong seven, but I'm not. I don't suspend people. They're they're things that are beyond my knowledge. And I know what I don't know.


00:29:44:18 - 00:30:01:07

Lazlo

And so I just don't do that. But you know, if you put a rope over somebody's elbow and you pinch their ulnar nerve, that's a problem. So I learned about that stuff as I got more schooled in the art. Like anything else, you know, you learn to play the guitar, you learn where the chords are on the neck, and it's like anything else.


00:30:01:09 - 00:30:23:01

Lazlo

It takes studying, it takes practice. And, having rote bottoms that are willing to work with you is great. And there are some schools around that do that with my my group. Imani has a, a member that runs a little place, Devil Mask Studios, where they teach cabaret and stuff like that. They're great. So if you want to learn about rope, go learn about, you know, the internet is your friend.


00:30:23:03 - 00:30:23:17

Lazlo

Yeah.


00:30:23:18 - 00:30:28:18

Luna

What about physical sensations giving or receiving? Like, what are your favorite things?


00:30:28:19 - 00:30:46:09

Lazlo

I don't know, a guy that doesn't like blowjobs. I'll be very honest, I do. I've interviewed a couple, I have it, I have my favorite T-shirt, and I wear this to the burn every year is it says I heart Jesus and Jesus is crossed out and just certain blowjobs closet. And that pisses off so many people. Look oral.


00:30:46:14 - 00:30:58:00

Lazlo

But I'll tell you what. Funny thing about oral sex is. It's only fun if the person that's giving it is enjoying it. Yeah, if someone's down there doing me a favor, I can tell. And I'd rather that not be that not happen, right.


00:30:58:00 - 00:31:06:18

Luna

Number of times I've had penis owning partners look at me and be like, it's like you actually like this. And I was like, yeah, when we were doing it, I didn't like it. And there's well.


00:31:06:20 - 00:31:24:03

Lazlo

Unfortunately, because of the way we are raised in our current society and people aren't taught that there is joy in giving and, you know, that kind of thing. A lot of girls think they have to give head because that's what they saw in a porn film. And it's like they have to have their head, like shut down and they have to gag.


00:31:24:03 - 00:31:37:01

Lazlo

And, you know, if you're into that, more power to you. If you're not, then your guy shouldn't be doing that to you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's again, that's all communication and understanding. But I don't know I don't know where to go from that. What are you talking about.


00:31:37:01 - 00:31:40:16

Luna

Blowjobs. Well I don't know balls. What are your balls like.


00:31:40:18 - 00:31:56:19

Lazlo

They're shaved. Yeah. Because if someone's down there, I want them to have a good time. Yeah. I have another shirt that says I shaved my balls for this with the big question where I. I like to wear funny shirts in sexually social spaces. One of my other favorite ones is I. Jesus forgot the safe word.


00:31:56:21 - 00:31:57:13

Luna

I don't get it.


00:31:57:15 - 00:32:02:01

Lazlo

Jesus got nailed to the cross. You don't have to say, okay, I got a bunch of.


00:32:02:06 - 00:32:12:10

Luna

When, when when you said the shirt with Jesus crossed out, it says blowjobs. It put a very dirty, naughty, terrible image into my mind of him getting a blowjob on the cross. Like, while being like, tortured to death.


00:32:12:10 - 00:32:14:04

Lazlo

You know, that's kind of weird, I know, but that's.


00:32:14:04 - 00:32:15:01

Luna

The stuff that pops into my.


00:32:15:01 - 00:32:17:02

Lazlo

Head. Yeah. Look, I because I was like, is.


00:32:17:02 - 00:32:18:10

Luna

That why people are getting mad about it?


00:32:18:10 - 00:32:35:21

Lazlo

But I have seen some shit. I've had people come to me and play me pieces of video. Now, the porn industry is very different now than it was 20 years ago. Okay. In the early 2000s, any schmuck with a camcorder could make a shit ton of money. Now you know you can't compete with free. The internet's full of free porn.


00:32:35:21 - 00:32:55:04

Lazlo

Yeah, and unless you're doing something that a lot of people like, or you've got a brand like evil Angel that's got, you know, years of of loyalty, it's hard to make money in porn. Right. And the beautiful thing about the internet is, if you like a particular thing, you can find it. Porn used to be sort of, you know, in the whatever it is, the, the, the range.


00:32:55:04 - 00:33:11:06

Lazlo

It's like everything's kind of in the middle. Everything is from like 4 to 6, right? There's nothing really weird on this site and there's nothing really weird on that site. It's all sort of lowest common denominator. Now you can put it on research thing and find it. Yeah. Okay. And that includes all the kinky stuff and unfortunately some of the illegal stuff.


00:33:11:08 - 00:33:32:08

Lazlo

But that is in a lot of ways destroyed the ability for real artists to make adult films. And people used to come to me when they would do consults about getting into the industry. And I mean, I was doing 4 or 5 a week of people come in and buying, you know, 3 or 4 hours of my time, I want to do this, I want to do this.


00:33:32:10 - 00:33:45:11

Lazlo

A lot of guys were like, yeah, I want to I want to like, produce movies so I can fuck the girls. I'm like, get out of my office. That's not what we're here for. Yeah, but people would bring me videos like, I've got this idea of doing this thing and they'd play it for me, like, can I get away with this?


00:33:45:13 - 00:34:10:08

Lazlo

And most of the times I'm like, no lawyer can tell you 100%. You're going to be able to get away with something because the obscenity just is nuts. And depending on where you are and what religion is prevalent in that area and what the Republicans are doing in any particular moment, that could be a problem. Even like plain old white bread porn, like boy on girl having like missionary sex can get you in trouble in the wrong time, in the wrong jurisdiction.


00:34:10:10 - 00:34:27:16

Lazlo

But there are some shit out there that can really, really get you in trouble if they get if it gets found. And I'm not talking about child pornography in reality, which are sort of on their own. Child pornography is illegal, period piece reality. It's not per se obscene, but there isn't a jury in this country that wouldn't find it obscene.


00:34:27:18 - 00:34:49:15

Lazlo

And the real reason is because an animal can't consent. Yeah, but, you know, anything short of that? I mean, there's there's pretend snuff films and there's all sorts. You know, it's funny, the there used to be a thing called the Cambria List. Cambria was Paul Cambria is Paul Amira, he was Larry Flynt somewhere. And the government used to try this out saying, well, these were the things that were illegal, and that's not what it was.


00:34:49:17 - 00:35:06:23

Lazlo

Larry had Paul do a research project to find out the things that have been historically prosecuted, and those were the things. And hustler didn't want to do those things because they didn't want to risk it. Right. And, you know, there were things, some things that you wouldn't think of today, like bondage with penetration was on that. Let's really tie someone up and fuck them.


00:35:06:23 - 00:35:19:19

Lazlo

That would get you arrested in the South faster. You know, we'd get you busted in the South faster than anything. A black guy on a white woman. Oh, shit. You want to go to jail in Mississippi? All you got to do is sell a porn film with a black eye and a white woman. Now, this is, you know, a long time ago.


00:35:19:22 - 00:35:43:22

Lazlo

This is in the 60s and 70s that made them crazy. You know, now it's a fetish, which is wrong in a different way. But, the, the, the world of porn and the way it's been regulated has been changing constantly. And people think, well, you know, of course I can get porn on, on the internet. Well, if you know what's going on in Texas and North Carolina and some of these states that are passing these online age verification laws.


00:35:44:00 - 00:36:04:10

Lazlo

Yeah. What about age verification? It's about making you like, sign up and put your name in something so people know that you've been watching porn and nobody wants to do that. Yeah. Porn is about privacy. Yeah. And so, you know, what I'm into is nobody else's business but wine and maybe my wife's maybe. So if you think you're safe with your sexual expression right now you're wrong.


00:36:04:12 - 00:36:14:12

Lazlo

And the court that we have, the Supreme Court that we have right now would love to gut Miller versus California, which is the current test for obscenity. And it's miserable. It's a lousy test.


00:36:14:12 - 00:36:16:20

Luna

But can you tell our listeners a little bit about it?


00:36:16:22 - 00:36:33:13

Lazlo

All right, so we got to go a little history lesson. Obscenity is very difficult to define. And there's a famous quote I think was Potter Stewart or says, I can't define it, but I know it when I see it. I have a sticker on my motorcycle helmet that says obscenities. Whatever gives a judge a boner. Neither of those are right.


00:36:33:15 - 00:36:53:06

Lazlo

The original doctrine started in a case in 1957 called Ross. And it was the utterly without redeeming social value test, and that didn't make any sense. And there was a middle test called memoirs. And then in 1973, the Supreme Court ruled in a case called Miller versus California, and they created a three part test for obscenity.


00:36:53:08 - 00:37:15:12

Lazlo

Whether the average person applying contemporary community standards would find it, the work, taken as a whole, appeals to a prurient interest in sex or excretion. Part two. Whether the work depicts or describes in a patently offensive way, sexual conduct specifically defined by the applicable state statute, and three whether the work taken as a whole like serious literary, artistic, political or scientific value.


00:37:15:14 - 00:37:38:04

Lazlo

Now, if you can tell me by looking at a piece of film whether it passes any of those things, you're a better lawyer than I. I've tried obscenity cases. I've never lost one. I had the last really big one was in, the District of Columbia in 2010. It was the evil angel, U.S. versus stallion, old Case, and it was myself, Paul Cambria, Lou Circuit and Bob Cohen Revere were the lawyers.


00:37:38:07 - 00:37:55:17

Lazlo

The dream team where I was in that, I have no idea. It was like those three lions of the First Amendment and me in. But we had a very scary open and a great close. Let's just put it that way. The judge really wanted to send my guy to jail and he was not messing around. And I'm kind of the class clown.


00:37:55:17 - 00:38:11:05

Lazlo

And those two were like, you know, did not mix. But long story short, we won the trial. We won it on a rule 29, which means we didn't even need to put on a defense. We just tore the government's witnesses apart, and the judge threw out the case. And my guy went home. And we had a great evening that night drinking milk shooters.


00:38:11:05 - 00:38:43:16

Lazlo

That's a very inside joke. One of the movies that was prosecuted was called Milk Nympho. That was a milk. And I'm a movie. Oh, yeah. And so we went to a bar and John bought a surround of milk shooters. Oh, my God, that we had fun. So, you know, the obscenity doctrine is this, like, sort super nebulous thing where it depends what jury you get and what lawyers defending it and whether they understand how to talk to a jury about that, whether they're actually comfortable talking to a jury about sex, because lawyers that are up there that think that this is horrible and filthy, and they're just out there doing their job that comes


00:38:43:16 - 00:38:52:08

Lazlo

across. Jurors can see that, and you can't have somebody like that. As your lawyer, if you're looking at 30 years in jail and convicted.


00:38:52:10 - 00:39:00:13

Luna

So so if someone out there listening is like, wait, I can't make money on porn? Oh my God, wait, I, I haven't only fans like, like, should they be afraid right now? Yeah. You're like.


00:39:00:13 - 00:39:25:12

Lazlo

Yeah, they really should. Oh there is a well, let me put it this way. There is so much of it out there that the odds of them finding you specifically is incredibly small, unless you were incredibly famous, or you're doing something that is so out of the norm that it gets noticed, it's kind of a catch 22, because the only way you really make a lot of money is by being famous and having a strong following.


00:39:25:12 - 00:39:41:19

Lazlo

But those are the things that get you noticed by some prosecutor somewhere who is on a mission from God looking to shut down this horrible porn person. And you know, anybody that tells you that porn isn't a political prosecution is lying to you, or they don't understand the concept. It always is.


00:39:41:21 - 00:39:50:03

Luna

There are a lot of people out there that say that porn is just like categorically bad, wrong, etc.. Yeah. Do you have more experience about like nuances of the industry?


00:39:50:04 - 00:40:07:17

Lazlo

Like my palms aren't, you know, furry or anything? I probably seen more porn than most people. I mean, I edited it for four years. Yeah, yeah. And, you know, I've been defending it for another 30, and I was involved in it before that. I used to sell Betamax video recorders to the porn industry when I worked at accelerated back in the early 80s.


00:40:07:19 - 00:40:31:09

Lazlo

So Federated. Federated was a, audio video store like us, Circuit City or Best Buy or something like that. And that's that's how I went from the music business to consumer electronics to broadcast electronics to editing porn and music videos to porn to law. That was the trip. Stumble, fall story. None of those, none of those steps were planned, by the way.


00:40:31:09 - 00:40:32:13

Lazlo

They just sort of happened.


00:40:32:13 - 00:40:34:12

Luna

I get it, life leads us places.


00:40:34:15 - 00:40:35:09

Lazlo

Yeah.


00:40:35:11 - 00:40:43:16

Luna

So have you ever like, learned about something through porn that you were like, let's do it. Like. Or was that part of your education process or is it kind of.


00:40:43:16 - 00:41:02:15

Lazlo

No, I'm not really. I don't think I ever saw anything in a movie that I thought, oh, that looks like fun. I want to try it, because being on the road with rock and roll bands will get you exposed to all sorts of wild shit. Good band. You know, the other thing is back then you had to like go to the store and rent a movie.


00:41:02:15 - 00:41:27:22

Lazlo

It's not like it was online where you could just like pop up Pornhub on your desk right now and or on your phone and see stuff that you don't normally see. So my experience with sexuality had developed somewhat naturally over a large period of time in a variety of variety of different things. And then when I was in the business, when I was in the porn business, there are I only dated a couple girls in the business that did not work for me at all.


00:41:28:00 - 00:41:51:05

Lazlo

And it wasn't the jealousy thing, it was the crazy thing. And one of you was gone, so I'm sorry. And the other one is still around somewhere, and I'm not sorry. But, dating a porn star is a complicated thing to do, even if you're okay with open sexuality. It just is. And it takes a lot.


00:41:51:05 - 00:42:00:10

Lazlo

It takes a very secure guy to do that. And I wasn't there yet, so part of it was me. And part of it was them. But they were also nuts. But a whole nother story.


00:42:00:14 - 00:42:09:01

Luna

What about other direction? Did you ever have, like, experiences from your music days where you were like, hey guys, I got a great idea for a porno or just boiled eggs?


00:42:09:05 - 00:42:23:15

Lazlo

I mean, I did a couple of, like, I paid for my 16 track audio recorder by doing music for a couple of porn movies way back. I had a 16 track in my living room in an apartment in Sherman Oaks before the 94 earthquake crushed the whole thing.


00:42:23:15 - 00:42:24:12

Luna

Oh, damn.


00:42:24:15 - 00:42:43:14

Lazlo

But, I mean, groupie porn has been out there long before I was a group, you know, before I was on the road. So that had been done. I mean, it would have been kind of interesting to do something like, What's that movie with, Kate Hudson? My almost, almost famous. It would have been really nice to do, like, a better, like a porn version of that.


00:42:43:17 - 00:43:01:00

Lazlo

I wouldn't be surprised if somebody did. I never saw it. I mean, I was I was really lucky, though. I mean, I added some of the Andrew Blake movies I shot. I edited some Cameron Grant films that were like, really like shot on film. Beautifully done. These guys were artists. And, you know, I did a Stuart Canterbury film.


00:43:01:01 - 00:43:25:03

Lazlo

I did a bunch of stuff for a bunch of like high end producers and high end directors. And I was a pretty I mean, I got a couple of NBA nominations back in the day. So I wasn't a bad editor. I didn't learn my sexuality from pornography. I learned to not be uptight about sexuality from pornography, because being around so many people that just didn't give a shit was kind of liberating.


00:43:25:05 - 00:43:37:14

Lazlo

Yeah. You know, in, in polite society, people are very uptight about their sexuality. It's, you know, no one's going to walk up to you in a bar that you don't know and start telling you about the last guy that gave a blowjob to just doesn't happen. Maybe you I mean, you're.


00:43:37:15 - 00:43:38:09

Luna

Always going to say.


00:43:38:15 - 00:43:59:23

Lazlo

I mean, you know, a guy that looks like me, it's kind of unusual. Okay, so when you're in the business and you know you're on set and you're just hanging around waiting, somebody's like, oh, you know, I just had the best fucking gangbang yesterday. It's like, you know what? Okay. You know, tell me all about it. And you get comfortable in that kind of world and it just makes a whole lot of things easier.


00:44:00:01 - 00:44:16:01

Lazlo

Yeah. Okay. It also makes it a lot easier for me professionally, right? Because people can come to me and they're not like, when you go to a lawyer, you picture this guy in a buttoned down suit and like Brooks Brothers and I'm not that guy. I know. I had long hair for the first 4 or 5 years I was playing, working as a lawyer.


00:44:16:01 - 00:44:24:23

Lazlo

And you can sit down in my office and tell me anything, and I'm not going to be offended or shocked unless there's children or animals involved. You know, that's not a problem for me. Yeah, yeah.


00:44:24:23 - 00:44:30:07

Luna

So I do remember our first conversation. I was like, oh, I can just tell him my regular stuff in my brain and not worry at all.


00:44:30:09 - 00:44:31:04

Lazlo

I'm not offended.


00:44:31:06 - 00:44:36:12

Luna

Yeah, not offended, but is there anything that you haven't done that you want to try?


00:44:36:13 - 00:44:37:09

Lazlo

I don't think so.


00:44:37:12 - 00:44:43:22

Luna

What about are there any, like, pornos you wish existed or adult content that you haven't seen that you like or like? Why isn't that out there?


00:44:44:00 - 00:45:03:20

Lazlo

Well, I mean, you know, it's funny you should ask that because I think what makes good porn is when the guy that's shooting it likes what he's watching. There's an authenticity to it. The performers are into the scene, and the director is directing something that he would jerk off to or worship. And so there's that authenticity there.


00:45:03:22 - 00:45:06:12

Luna

That's my favorite kind of voyeurism I like is holding the camera.


00:45:06:13 - 00:45:27:21

Lazlo

That is lacking in a massive amount of porn today. And yeah, it always has been. But there are some people out there that were very careful about picking performers that wanted to work together with directors that did that thing for them, and those scenes are magic, right? Like when you say, is there anything that I would want to do that I haven't done?


00:45:27:23 - 00:45:43:05

Lazlo

No, there may be some people that I'd love to play with that I haven't played with, and I'm not going to name them for obvious reasons, but it's more an ego thing than, like, I haven't done that thing, so I feel like I'm missing out on something. It's just like, oh, it'd be really cool to be able to tell my friends I had sex with.


00:45:43:05 - 00:45:50:15

Lazlo

Oh, okay. Okay, okay. And a lot of the people that I play with, I don't talk about anyway for. That's what I mean. Gentlemens don't talk.


00:45:50:19 - 00:45:56:03

Luna

Oh, yeah. I mean, I share everything privately and anonymously on my Patreon, so I.


00:45:56:03 - 00:46:04:23

Lazlo

Don't do that. Yeah. And I think, you know, you know, this sounds a little creepy. I'm obviously significantly older than most of the people that I play with. Okay.


00:46:05:00 - 00:46:06:05

Luna

I mean, I don't know if it's obvious.


00:46:06:05 - 00:46:24:18

Lazlo

Well, it's it's trust me on this one. I mean, my partner is 26 years younger than I am. Okay. And most of the people that I run with are in their 20s and 30s and 40s. And I have a new friend that I'm very fond of who is older, but not by much. And so a lot of the people that I run with are much younger.


00:46:24:18 - 00:46:33:02

Lazlo

And the funny thing is, of late, I've been getting hit on by a lot of 20 somethings. Who are, I think, working through daddy issues.


00:46:33:04 - 00:46:33:18

Luna

Possibly.


00:46:33:18 - 00:46:48:15

Lazlo

And I don't want to I don't want to be fetishized for being an older guy. Right. And so one of the things that I like when I talk to these people is like, well, you know, why me? Well, you know, you're you're older than my dad. I'm like, ooh, that's that's the wrong answer. You know, the right answer is, I think you're cool.


00:46:48:15 - 00:47:00:22

Lazlo

And I think you've got something fun to say. And I could probably learn some stuff from you, and it looks sexy, and I really, I that would be awesome. But it's like, oh, yeah, you know, you're over 60. And the oldest guy I've ever done is 45. Yeah. I want to fuck you now. I'm not interested.


00:47:01:00 - 00:47:04:00

Luna

You know. Oh, because then you're just like, I'm just a little bucket list.


00:47:04:04 - 00:47:05:03

Lazlo

I'm just a fucking number.


00:47:05:04 - 00:47:08:21

Luna

Oh, my number I did. Yeah, yeah. Ooh. Yeah, that's that's grungy.


00:47:09:01 - 00:47:32:21

Lazlo

There's something very, informative about this. You know, I've had women for years. Tell me especially like Asian women, for example. They're sexualized and they're fetishized. Right. And I have a lot of Asian female friends, and they're like, that guy just wanted to fuck me because he's never fucked an Asian girl before. Black girl. Same thing. That guy just wanted to fuck me because I'm a woman of color, and I've never been able to grok that from, you know, I hear it.


00:47:32:21 - 00:47:52:02

Lazlo

I understand it intellectually, but I can't feel it because I'm not a black girl. I'm not an Asian girl. But now I'm an older guy that young girls are hitting on. And so now I can grok that because it's the same thing. It's being fetishized for something other than who you are, right? And so that has opened up something in my brain that I hadn't thought about previously.


00:47:52:02 - 00:48:05:17

Luna

That's so interesting. Can you tell me, guys of a certain age I've noticed, like guys that are, I don't know, over 40 like to like talk about being older. They say like, I'm so old and like I'm about to be 35. Like, I don't feel old.


00:48:05:17 - 00:48:13:01

Lazlo

I feel so world's major island architecture. I wish I was 35 if I knew then what I know now. Oh man.


00:48:13:04 - 00:48:27:15

Luna

Teach me everything you know. Like, why do people talk about being all and like, what does it mean? And I don't see it like one time I did have sex with a partner who I knew was much older than I was, and I wasn't, like, we had a sweet connection. And then I found out he was almost 90, you know, and I was like, whoa.


00:48:27:20 - 00:48:33:00

Luna

And then we were both turned on. And after the no. He was in great health, like, yeah.


00:48:33:02 - 00:48:45:05

Lazlo

And the old joke, yeah, that little old Jewish man goes to the doctor. Doctor, I met this guy. She's 30. She's beautiful. Mr. Schwartz, you're 90 years old. You know, this could be dangerous, doc, if she dies, she dies.


00:48:45:07 - 00:48:47:04

Luna

But also, what a way to go.


00:48:47:06 - 00:48:51:15

Lazlo

Hey, that's the way I'm gonna go. Yeah. Look, I don't think about being old.


00:48:51:20 - 00:48:53:11

Luna

Yeah, that's what I'm gonna ask, okay? Cuz you're a.


00:48:53:11 - 00:49:11:03

Lazlo

Mormon. Just mornings I wake up and, like, every fucking thing hurts. And it's like, if I'd been out the night before, late, late night where I've consumed something that I probably should have, shouldn't have consumed or whatever, it takes me a day or two to recover that. It didn't used to. Okay. But it's funny. We have like we have our master bedroom in our house is up this thing of stairs.


00:49:11:03 - 00:49:23:02

Lazlo

And when we get to the bottom of the stairs, there's this full length mirror and I'll get up some mornings. And I just feel great. And I think I'm a long haired 30 year old. And I go up and down the stairs and I get in front of the mirror and I'm like, who the fuck is that guy?


00:49:23:04 - 00:49:47:02

Lazlo

You know, where did I where did me go? And who's that? So I don't I don't think about it all the time, but there are times where I will see a reflection of myself or something in a room full of kids, and I'm like, no, that doesn't look right, you know? And I tell a lot of my friends, and I tell the people at parties that I go to, I never want anybody to think of me as the creepy old guy in the room.


00:49:47:06 - 00:49:56:10

Lazlo

Yeah, okay. Because I've seen that when I was in my late teens and early 20s, there were some Hollywood parties that I went to with salad balls of cocaine and shit where they're really juicy.


00:49:56:14 - 00:49:57:02

Luna

Salad.


00:49:57:06 - 00:49:59:00

Lazlo

And salad bowls. Okay, okay, okay.


00:49:59:00 - 00:49:59:08

Luna

That's what.


00:49:59:08 - 00:50:15:18

Lazlo

You said. That's what I said. Those stories are not lies. I mean, there were some fucking rock n parties back in the day, but there were, like, these, like 50 and 60 and 70 year old, like old creepers that would just walk up to like, you know, 20 year old girls and grab them and throw them in a bathroom and stuff.


00:50:15:18 - 00:50:34:03

Lazlo

God, I never want anybody to think that's me under any circumstances. And so, you know, every so often I'll see myself and go, oh, I could see why somebody that, you know, is new to this group would see me and go, what is that guy doing here? You know, whose grandfather is that? And I'm cognizant of it, but it's not something that just lives in my head all the time.


00:50:34:03 - 00:50:39:02

Luna

Right, right, right. Okay. So it's not only a defense against the young people that are fetishizing you, but.


00:50:39:03 - 00:50:59:13

Lazlo

No, it's it's purely a defense against the young people that fantasize, and look, there have been a couple that have gotten past the wall, I'm not going to lie. But, you know, they've got something more than just that. There's something more going on there. Again, I'm a Scorpio, so a pretty young girl, even if she says all the right things, the light's not on behind her eyes.


00:50:59:13 - 00:51:02:06

Lazlo

I'm really not that interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I totally get that.


00:51:02:08 - 00:51:11:01

Luna

So do you have any stories of a clear, explicit yes moment that was totally hot. I feel like you probably a lot of them. Sounds like you.


00:51:11:02 - 00:51:29:16

Lazlo

All right, I'll tell you my favorite orgy dome story. This happened, and I'm not exactly sure what year. I think it was 2012. But when you've done I've done 22 burns and they all kind of blur together. One of the things that happens periodically an orgy time. We are couples in Morrison's only we don't allow singles, men or women.


00:51:29:18 - 00:51:30:18

Lazlo

Because, I mean, make.


00:51:30:18 - 00:51:31:17

Luna

It a friend. What?


00:51:31:17 - 00:51:33:07

Lazlo

Yeah, well, it shouldn't be hard.


00:51:33:09 - 00:51:34:19

Luna

I'll just be a volunteer. No, I'm.


00:51:34:19 - 00:51:43:18

Lazlo

Well, if you can't with us, you can go in with other can't. But you can't go in alone because we don't want creepers. And if we let single women in, and we have to let single guys.


00:51:43:18 - 00:51:48:16

Luna

In and accidentally make friends with someone, I know that's ahead of time.


00:51:48:16 - 00:51:51:06

Lazlo

So we have ways of dealing with that. But let me get to the story.


00:51:51:06 - 00:51:52:00

Luna

Okay.


00:51:52:02 - 00:52:09:10

Lazlo

So one of the things that we encounter periodically is straight guys pretending to be gay. And they'll show up together and like, oh yeah, we're a couple. And so what we used to do is, okay, kiss and they'd like, freak out, and we don't do that anymore because the LGBTQ community reached out to us. A number of people said, you know, you don't meet hetero couples do that.


00:52:09:10 - 00:52:10:22

Lazlo

Why do you make gay couples do that?


00:52:11:02 - 00:52:11:20

Luna

And your response.


00:52:11:20 - 00:52:12:12

Lazlo

Was the response.


00:52:12:14 - 00:52:13:03

Luna

Everyone should.


00:52:13:03 - 00:52:29:06

Lazlo

Get, yeah, we really shouldn't do that. So we start. We have other ways of dealing with it, but back in the day, that's what we were doing at the time. Okay. And so these two frat boys, show up and I was actually done after that night. I was doing consent talks and, you know, okay, you guys are a couple.


00:52:29:06 - 00:52:51:00

Lazlo

Oh, cool. Kiss. And they're like, And I'm like, you guys are busted, you know? Come on now, 20 minutes before this, a woman shows up with three guys on leashes. They each had collars on. She had three leashes in her hand. And she had these three guys behind her. And they were, you know, mid 20s, strapping Adonis types.


00:52:51:02 - 00:53:09:18

Lazlo

And she was five, 11, five, you know, six foot red hair in latex. Just an 11 on a 1 to 10. She was an 11. And she had these three guys with her. And I did their consent talk and she's like, hey, what are you doing? And I'm like, I'm here because you want to come in with us.


00:53:09:18 - 00:53:26:14

Lazlo

I'm like, I can't, I'm working. Thanks. Can't do it, really? Because she goes, what happened when you're off shift? I'm like, if you're still here, we'll talk. But right now I'm working. So she goes in a couple of minutes later, these two guys come over and they're busted. They're not getting in and like, well, can we just sit down out here and figure out what we're going to do next?


00:53:26:14 - 00:53:45:06

Lazlo

I'm like, sure, there's chairs around the front. So they sit down and the front of the dome zips open and this woman sticks her head out. She's like naked. Just I need another cock. And everybody's like, what? She goes, you. And she points at one of the guys is like, no, I can't. I got and she goes, how about you?


00:53:45:10 - 00:54:04:07

Lazlo

He's like, no, I can't just pussies. And she zips the thing back up and goes back inside. She burned through her three and she was looking for more. And I'm sitting there like I've got the biggest shit eating grin on my face. And these guys are just mortified. And they get up to walk back and it's like, if they had tails, they would have been tucked between the eyes.


00:54:04:09 - 00:54:22:13

Lazlo

And I stopped them on the way out and I said, guys, not today, not tomorrow. But one of these days you're going to realize that you just missed the best opportunity of your life, because if you just said yeah to her, I don't let you go in. That's that's my favorite. Yeah. They weren't ready. They weren't ready. Wow.


00:54:22:15 - 00:54:27:20

Lazlo

That's my favorite orgy story. And I've got a thousand of them, but that's my favorite one.


00:54:27:22 - 00:54:32:21

Luna

Dang. When you're working, do you just get to observe so many interesting things?


00:54:32:21 - 00:54:54:08

Lazlo

You know, my favorite thing to do at Burning Man is consent talks. Yeah, because people come and they're no pun intended and come to the structure. And many of them are very nervous. Yeah. And it's my job to make them feel safe and comfortable and explain how everything's going to work. And I watch that sort of nervousness turn into like, giddiness into, oh, this is going to be fun.


00:54:54:10 - 00:55:07:22

Lazlo

And, you know, in the in the years I've been doing this, maybe I can count on one hand the number of times where someone's gone in and they've come right back. I'm like, nope, this is not for us. Okay? Usually they go in and sometimes they'll plop down in a mattress and they'll fool around a little bit and they'll get up and leave.


00:55:08:00 - 00:55:22:07

Lazlo

But usually they're in there for a while and they come out and they're all happy and they've just had a lovely time. Sometimes they come out with other couples in tow, and they've never done anything like that, and that's the best. And like, and they'll come over and they give me a hug. It's like, you've just changed our lives.


00:55:22:07 - 00:55:33:17

Lazlo

Thank you. And that's super fucking rewarding. And then I can build art and I can make music. But there's something about affecting someone's life, you know, for the rest of their life that is really rewarding. Yeah.


00:55:33:19 - 00:55:42:10

Luna

Yeah. What sex wise do you feel like you're the best at? And how did you get good at it?


00:55:42:12 - 00:55:44:00

Lazlo

I'm not the best at anything.


00:55:44:00 - 00:55:46:13

Luna

No. For your own personal self. Not like better than other people.


00:55:46:13 - 00:55:56:12

Lazlo

I'm pretty good at giving oral. And it's just from practice, practice, practice and listening and communicating with new people. Yeah I, I'm very I'm too communicative with. No.


00:55:56:12 - 00:55:57:02

Luna

What do you mean?


00:55:57:03 - 00:55:58:00

Lazlo

I mean I'm, I mean.


00:55:58:01 - 00:56:05:09

Luna

I'm too communicative because I get told my partner is like, could you, could you lower the talking? But I also give them that permission from the start, because I know that I like to have a full conversation.


00:56:05:09 - 00:56:21:17

Lazlo

I'd really spend, you know, time with somebody before I jump into bed with them. And I want to know all the things I like, and I especially want to know the things they don't like. And I'll ask if there are things that trigger them for whatever reason, because people have been through bad things and sometimes, like, you know, just the wrong, like, touch my left boob with your right hand.


00:56:21:17 - 00:56:45:18

Lazlo

And that reminds me of my Uncle Fred. You know, I don't want to do that. So I want to get way down into the nitty gritty beforehand. And sometimes that's uncomfortable. A lot of people aren't used to having that in-depth conversation. But I find it works for me. And then, you know, between that and having been with a fair number of people over the years and learning how people squirm when they're enjoying themselves, you know, I'm relatively good at that.


00:56:45:23 - 00:56:52:12

Lazlo

You know, I'm not like, I, I'm not hung like a bull moose. So it's certainly not my, you know, a ginormous memory that keeps him coming back.


00:56:52:18 - 00:57:00:08

Luna

I mean, that's usually just my personal experience. I feel like sizes, he really got to know how to use the sizable tool, and.


00:57:00:09 - 00:57:11:14

Lazlo

Yeah. Anyway, I've. I mean, a lot of my friends have very sizable tools, and I'm. I wouldn't say I'm envious. It would be kind of fun to have that now and again. But then again, you can't hurt somebody with that.


00:57:11:15 - 00:57:29:09

Luna

That's what I'm just going to say. It's like you have to make sure that. And sometimes you got to wear donut. Depending on how the shapes or shapes. Yeah. What about 19 years of an open relationship? Like what can you what wisdom can you share about non-monogamy? You don't have to give details, but just like, what's your favorite thing about not not doesn't always work.


00:57:29:11 - 00:57:29:14

Lazlo

I.


00:57:29:14 - 00:57:31:04

Luna

Mean, no relationship, always.


00:57:31:04 - 00:57:54:15

Lazlo

Work. The most important thing you can do is be honest with your partner and check in with them periodically. Yeah, we've we've had some tough times. We've had some great times. And, you know, I'm not going to say her name, but she's a phenomenal person. She I the running gag when she first came to LA and people were asking me because I was 47 and she was 21, and I tried to blow her off.


00:57:54:15 - 00:58:09:02

Lazlo

Initially I thought she was a plant because she looked 15. I thought she was a set up, a government set up. Oh, damn. Yeah. I'd won this weird obscenity trial and had been warned. And it's a long story, but my friends would ask me, like, what are you doing with this young girl? I'm like, she's my retirement plan.


00:58:09:04 - 00:58:24:00

Lazlo

And I was joking because I thought I'd be supporting this pretty little thing for the rest of my life. And she's doing great. She has really made a name for herself. I mean, she already is a hitter and she's going to be a big hitter. It wouldn't surprise me at all if she ends up running a network or a studio or something.


00:58:24:00 - 00:58:42:18

Lazlo

I mean, this girl knows what she's doing. It's. It's really impressive to watch somebody, you know, go from 21 to 40. And at 40 years old, this girl's got her shit completely together. And at 40 years old, I had, like, I was in my first year of my practice and I was hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt and didn't know how I was going to feed myself.


00:58:42:18 - 00:58:52:06

Lazlo

And she's got a lot of money in the bank. So good on her, you know? But she's she's an amazing human being. I love her to death. I run into a burning building for, Beautiful.


00:58:52:08 - 00:59:06:19

Luna

I was noodling with a friend recently about why. You know, because she was sort of like, I don't like poly. I don't like the phrase non-monogamy. I don't like that. I was like, what about just the idea of calling it an honest relationship? You know, because I feel like so many normies just are lying to each other about the other attraction.


00:59:06:19 - 00:59:08:13

Lazlo

And and when you.


00:59:08:13 - 00:59:09:23

Luna

Went on the monogamous people they.


00:59:09:23 - 00:59:26:02

Lazlo

Lied to, they lie to when you're with somebody for a long time, you need something to make that spark happen. And I'm no expert on this. Believe me. I've had my relationship problems with my partner, and I'm the last guy you want to go to for relationship advice. We're still together for now. You know, what can I tell you?


00:59:26:04 - 00:59:50:03

Lazlo

When you're with somebody for a long time, you need something to spark that up. And some guys, that lingerie is that you dress up different every weekend and you got a new girl, and it's great. Some guys have Alzheimer's. And every time it's the first time, that joke. But there's got to be something that sparks you. And so if it's other people in your bed or you're off with someone else and you come back and talk to your partner about it, whatever it is that gets you two going is what you got to do to keep the thing going.


00:59:50:05 - 01:00:11:21

Lazlo

And you know, for us, it's it's personal and we don't talk about our relationship. It sort of in general, I think non-monogamy is a more honest way of doing things because everybody's interested. I mean, I don't know a guy who hasn't walked down the street and had some girl walk by and was going, you know, just do that.


01:00:11:21 - 01:00:21:19

Lazlo

Right. Well, if you do that in front of your wife and she smacks you across the side of the head, you start resenting your partner for not letting you look at something else.


01:00:22:01 - 01:00:23:00

Luna

It's like a fear.


01:00:23:02 - 01:00:45:07

Lazlo

Yeah, and I'm just talking about looking. Now imagine what that would be like if it's like, well, I'm going to go play with her. And she smacked you across the face or took half of your stuff through the divorce lawyer. The ability to do stuff with other people makes a stronger relationship. I don't think that my wife is going to leave me if she has sex with somebody that gets her off right?


01:00:45:07 - 01:01:00:07

Lazlo

That's not my thing. I'm not slightly worried about that. I don't think she's worried about that either. Right. So if I know she's coming home to me and I'm going home to her. And so that's that's more important than who I stick my dick in. Yeah.


01:01:00:09 - 01:01:08:10

Luna

It sounds like there's nothing else really on your sexy bucket list. But what about your creative bucket list more broadly, or original bucket list? I don't know,


01:01:08:12 - 01:01:23:13

Lazlo

Or, you know, I really want to take the I want to take the show on the road. I really want to get the band out. We've been talking about doing that for a few years. Yeah, there's been a lot of things that we had to change. We had some political shit in camp, and we redesigned the entire structures that cost a lot of money to two years ago, and we're still working through that.


01:01:23:15 - 01:01:41:16

Lazlo

But getting a box truck and being able to go out on the road will be great. I really want to finish an album this year. I've been promising myself I would do that for years. I have a massive studio in my house. I do a lot of stuff for other people, but I start 40 songs a year and I don't finish any of them, which is something, a lot of people have that problem.


01:01:41:16 - 01:02:00:09

Lazlo

I'm going to force myself to finish something this year, and I may write some political shit in the near term because of politics right now, but we'll see. Yeah, but that's not something I really want to do. I want to get back on a stage and I well, I was working for a, guy named Jean-Luc Ponty back in the day, in the late 70s as a jazz violinist.


01:02:00:11 - 01:02:24:23

Lazlo

And we opened for Supertramp, the Canadian tour in 79, when Breakfast in America was the biggest record in the world. That's awesome. So they had us at one point up on a stage. I got to sing in the background choir for Supertramp in front of 70,000 people. And, you know, the thing comes up out of the stage and I've got some stupid costume on, and there's all these people out there with lighters and there's not.


01:02:24:23 - 01:02:41:14

Lazlo

I mean, there's nothing like that feel. Yeah. If you were a performer, there is nothing like being on a stage in front of a lot of people. And I love doing 200 venues. I love, like and Burning Man, the last big mutator show we probably had 30,000 people in front of us. Wow. It was great. Damn, there's some stuff floating around on the internet right now on Facebook.


01:02:41:16 - 01:02:58:00

Lazlo

I mean, it's been 20 years and a lot of that stuff is starting to come. I was like, Holy shit, who are those guys? Because people have forgotten how the band ended. But, and I'm not going to go into that here, but, it was really fun. And we had a lot of the playa were mutator fans.


01:02:58:01 - 01:03:02:18

Lazlo

And so going to something that I love and having all of those people watch me do it was really fun.


01:03:02:21 - 01:03:09:05

Luna

That's so cool. Do you experience a connection or like, does your creativity feature sexy parts? Does your sexy parts feed your creativity?


01:03:09:05 - 01:03:30:08

Lazlo

No, they're kind of different things. Okay. I mean, I have like I like lingerie. There are there are certain looks that I like. I like fetish wear. And I can put an outfit together for my partner that I think is hot. You know, that that's sort of a crossover, I guess, is, you know, creative and sexy. But my music stuff, I mean, I like spinning at play parties.


01:03:30:08 - 01:03:49:17

Lazlo

I do sets at play. I did the kinks New Year's Eve party and I think that there is a there's a right kind of music for play parties, guys. You go to the play parties and play like dubstep and shit. Don't know what the fuck they're doing. That's not the right kind of music. You know, something like 122 beats per minute.


01:03:49:17 - 01:04:01:08

Lazlo

Like deep house, like in, you know, minor keys, like C minor. There's a vibe to playing music for a sex party where you can, like, feed the energy of the party as opposed to rec the energy.


01:04:01:10 - 01:04:02:02

Luna

Totally, totally.


01:04:02:08 - 01:04:05:04

Lazlo

And so I'm real good at that thing.


01:04:05:06 - 01:04:11:21

Luna

What about, like, when you're really sexually satisfied? Do you ever get, like, musically inspired? Like as a writer? As a creator?


01:04:11:23 - 01:04:23:03

Lazlo

No, I mean, I've, I've written I've written some songs for girls that I loved. I'm not really as much of a songwriter as far as vocals. I'm not a I have good enough pitch to know that I can't sing for shit. Okay.


01:04:23:05 - 01:04:24:06

Luna

Not even at karaoke.


01:04:24:07 - 01:04:42:01

Lazlo

No, I do not sing karaoke. I just, I know, give me a guitar. I'll stand up in front of you and fumble my way through, okay? No, I'm not a singer. I write instrumental music. Sometimes it's inspired by people. Sometimes it's inspired by, like, just. I feel shitty today. I don't want to get something down because it helps me, you know, cathartic.


01:04:42:04 - 01:04:48:15

Lazlo

Get it out. But a lot of times I get it down and I get three bars in and like, oh, this is crap. Oh, what am I on? My worst critic.


01:04:48:18 - 01:04:56:18

Luna

I get that. What do you think we collectively in the world need to make it a sexier, more loving place?


01:04:56:20 - 01:04:59:00

Lazlo

Education? Education? Education.


01:04:59:00 - 01:05:00:15

Luna

What kind? Like what would it look like?


01:05:00:15 - 01:05:26:17

Lazlo

We need to get rid of the shame element of sexuality. It's religiously driven. It's bullshit. Our puritanical views on sexuality are the result of 5000 year old thinking about how do we control a population from doing stupid shit, and the only way we can convince them that like to be good is because that orange ball that comes up over there is some sort of divine being, and if you do something wrong, you're going to go to hell and burn forever.


01:05:26:18 - 01:05:43:04

Lazlo

We don't need that shit anymore. We're human beings and we have, you know, we we can reason our way through things. And you don't have to be celibate till marriage. God, you shouldn't be. And we got to get over that religious dogma, the concept of sexuality. That's what we got to do. Yeah.


01:05:43:06 - 01:05:55:18

Luna

Are you able, when you're having these talks with people in the Orgy Dome, are you able to, like, see when shame is coming up? You mentioned being able to tell if someone is nervous, but I'm not good at that, so I shame explode people often because I don't have the same kind as I.


01:05:55:20 - 01:06:15:00

Lazlo

I'm. I'm very gentle in my consent talks. I tend to do them kind of as a stand up comedy routine, because I've done them for, you know, 15 years and I'm very fluent in it. And I want to make people at ease. And I find, like, I'm I've always been the class clown. So it's just the way I relate to people.


01:06:15:00 - 01:06:30:07

Lazlo

And that tends to disarm people. But if I see like a couple, like looking at each other and one of them is like, you know, I get that, I'm very tuned into that. And so and I will take a couple of time. Go. Look, there's nothing wrong with going and sitting in Aphrodite's garden deciding you don't want to do this and leaving.


01:06:30:07 - 01:06:45:01

Lazlo

Or you can go back to camp now and have a discussion with your partner in your RV or in your tent and go, look, this is I don't feel comfortable right now. Maybe we'll do it tomorrow, maybe we won't do it. But I'm not comfortable right now, and we'd rather you do that. Then do something you don't want to do.


01:06:45:03 - 01:07:01:22

Lazlo

So we train our dome readers to be very aware of that kind of hesitancy. And it's not necessarily shame. I don't know what's causing it. It might be shame it, you know, it might be flat out terror. They might like, they might just be there with somebody from their camp, but they got kind of bullied into going with us.


01:07:02:01 - 01:07:04:19

Lazlo

We don't want any of that. No, no, no, I don't oh no.


01:07:04:21 - 01:07:06:11

Luna

How long are those talks by the way?


01:07:06:12 - 01:07:10:09

Lazlo

They vary. They're usually around a half hour to 45 minutes. They take a while okay.


01:07:10:10 - 01:07:15:11

Luna

Wow. Yeah. That's an investment in small groups. Sounds like you want a couple. Or is it like, it's usually.


01:07:15:11 - 01:07:30:22

Lazlo

I mean, depends. If we're not super busy, we'll do it as couples. Okay? We get stupid busy. I mean, the line goes, Aphrodite's garden was our first attempt to, like, get rid of the line because people would come in and and go out the street and down, you know, the out the structure, down the fence and down the street.


01:07:31:03 - 01:07:49:11

Lazlo

And the Rangers were getting mad at us. So it's like, okay, so we created this interior space for the overflow. So they get the orientation and they go into Aphrodite's garden and the line still goes down around the corner. And we do the best we can. We get on any given year, we give around 8000 wristbands.


01:07:49:13 - 01:08:12:20

Lazlo

And most of those people that was in the last time we counted was 2018. We gave out 8000 wristbands. Most people come back 2 or 3 times. Okay. And so, you know, you do the numbers. It's like half the city has come into play in our space. It's really it's impressive. And I'm very proud of it. I can't take credit for all of it.


01:08:12:20 - 01:08:24:03

Lazlo

There were a lot of people that helped it get to where it is now, but the group that we have that are running it now are really good at what they do, and I'm very proud of them, and I hope I can hand it off to somebody else next year and let someone else do it.


01:08:24:06 - 01:08:30:15

Luna

That's awesome. Is there anything you want to tell our sweet listeners? If they're like, burning injuries or you? I'm curious, like, oh man, go.


01:08:30:15 - 01:08:56:19

Lazlo

It's the coolest thing. I've been a rockstar and a porn lawyer. Nothing is better than Burning Man. I mean, I'm wearing my little. I never take this thing off. It's my little Burning man. Dude. I probably drank the Kool-Aid. If it's a cult, I'm a member. But I don't think it's a cult. It is the best example of the First Amendment at play, because you can go out there and do pretty much anything you want to do, as long as you don't blow up your neighbor and, you will see things that will change your concept of art.


01:08:56:21 - 01:09:16:05

Lazlo

You will hear music that will change your concept of music. There's all sorts of stuff out there. I mean, there's country and western bands and there's I mean, tool debut debut, Fear Inoculum at Burning Man Island in 2018. The theme was I, robot and Alan Alan Parsons heard about it and came and performed the whole thing at Burning Man.


01:09:16:06 - 01:09:33:08

Lazlo

It's just the most amazing place. And I'll be going every year till I drop dead. So, I highly recommend it if you want to go study it up before you go. Don't show up without goggles and dust masks and bags. Go with it. I would suggest you find yourself a themed camp to go with the first time.


01:09:33:10 - 01:09:49:07

Lazlo

So you have people around you that know what they're doing. I teach the LA regional orientations. All of the major cities have Burning Man regionals, and you can find some, you know, a meeting where you can go and talk to people that have done this before and were very helpful. If you want to go to Burning Man, reach out.


01:09:49:07 - 01:09:56:20

Lazlo

I know a guy. So yeah, I've, dragged a whole lot of people to Burning Man over the years. A whole lot of people. Fuck yeah.


01:09:56:22 - 01:10:06:07

Luna

Okay, so if you had to be a sex worker for two years in a new world where everyone has to, everyone must serve their country in this way.


01:10:06:09 - 01:10:08:03

Lazlo

My fantasy sounds fun.


01:10:08:04 - 01:10:10:01

Luna

How would you serve?


01:10:10:03 - 01:10:19:22

Lazlo

Who would be a daddy nom? I'd be me. I facilitate for pay, but for pay I'd facilitate fun, sexy experiences for people. Easy. Great. What I do, I.


01:10:19:22 - 01:10:33:10

Luna

Love it, I fucking love it. Okay, this might be a boring question for you, but if you had an unlimited budget to create your perfect play space, castle structure, etc., what what would it be like?


01:10:33:12 - 01:10:56:19

Lazlo

If you couple that camp with this? The last year that I've heard about for years. But I finally met him last year. I have a house in Vegas. I'm not going to Namedrop here, but, they have a spectacular home in Las Vegas. I don't want to live in Vegas, by the way. I just nothing personal. Okay, but they have a fantastic home, and there's a dungeon out back, and it's just it's decorated beautifully.


01:10:56:21 - 01:11:15:13

Lazlo

It's just a fantastic party house. It's the nicest party house I've ever seen. And I've been in, like, mansions all over the world, in the Hamptons and all sorts of places. Sir Ivan's house in the Hamptons. Pretty legit. But, this particular house that I've seen, they built it or they bought it as a content house.


01:11:15:15 - 01:11:23:20

Lazlo

And so people shoot there. And it's just spectacular. I don't think I change a thing, I really don't.


01:11:23:22 - 01:11:24:12

Luna

I think I'm gonna.


01:11:24:12 - 01:11:25:21

Lazlo

Put in a better sound system, but.


01:11:26:00 - 01:11:37:05

Luna

Okay. Okay. Good to know. Good to know. I think I've been invited there. I think I need to go. Okay. Lovers links are in the description below. Alan Laszlo, thank you for being a guest on IG stories.


01:11:37:06 - 01:11:38:11

Lazlo

My pleasure. Thanks for having me.

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