226 | Basking in Afterglow: Lilly Sparks on Woo
- Luna Robbie
- Aug 18, 2023
- 42 min read
30s heterosexual white female, she/her pronouns, monogamous, divorcée, founder and CEO of Afterglow, ethical porn and guided masturbations.
🔗 LILLY LINKS | xoafterglow.com / @xoaftergloww / x / linkedin / facebook
00:00:00:03 - 00:00:23:13
Luna
And our guest today is here to share her expertise both personally and professionally. She's a mid 36 woman, a monogamous divorcee now engaged to her new boo. She started a woman focused porn company whose mission is to help people have great sex. Based on her experience coming to her own sexuality as an adult. She is into sensual dance and movement, overcoming any kind of lingering anxiety.
00:00:23:13 - 00:00:28:22
Luna
And it's practicing using her sex couch with increasing regularity. Welcome, Lily Sparks.
00:00:29:00 - 00:00:31:19
Lilly
Hello. Hello! I'm so happy to be here.
00:00:31:21 - 00:00:47:22
Luna
I am so happy to have you here. Could you pretty please start off by telling our sweet listeners? If you had to rate yourself on a sexual shame a meter from one being totally shameless to ten being so full of shame. Where do you fall right now? And what has it looked like over the years?
00:00:48:00 - 00:01:13:04
Lilly
I would say I'm a three right now, which maybe I am like a two or a one, but I just hang out with such amazing sex positive people all the time that you start to, like, have your radar get a little fuzzy. You know, I grew up in a conservative family where we did not talk about sex, and it always seemed like this awesome thing, like everybody was talking about it, like it was this awesome, amazing thing.
00:01:13:06 - 00:01:36:06
Lilly
But I would say at that point in my life, kind of early 20s, I was probably more of like A67 because part of my origin story is that I was in a relationship with my high school sweetheart, so we met when we were 15. He was my first and only partner, and we had no idea what we were doing.
00:01:36:08 - 00:01:53:19
Lilly
Like most teenagers, and I just felt really alone and really lost in like, how do I figure that out? Because I love to learn. And when it came to any other subject, you know, there's books, there's TV shows, there's all these things. But when it came to sex, I was just like, where do I go? What do I do?
00:01:53:21 - 00:02:23:22
Lilly
I wasn't orgasming, I didn't end up orgasming until I was 24. I was ashamed that something was wrong with me. I was ashamed that I wasn't feeling the way I thought other people were. And it's really been a journey. I ended up getting divorced from my high school sweetheart. We were together from when I was 15 to 30, and that kind of started me on this kind of second wave of sexual exploration and getting rid of shame and figuring out what I liked and what I felt good about.
00:02:24:00 - 00:02:33:13
Lilly
That plus starting afterglow, which I'll talk about, is really what kind of helped me get from that, like 6 or 7 level shame down to at three.
00:02:33:15 - 00:02:43:19
Luna
That's awesome. Was any of the early shame because of the conservative ness, or was it more just like, fuck, I should be experiencing these things because it doesn't? I didn't hear that in part of your story.
00:02:43:21 - 00:03:02:20
Lilly
Yeah, I think it was my family. It was our culture. It's that, you know, the most of the sex messages we have are like sex ed, which is like, don't get pregnant, don't get an STD, and never like, this is how it should feel. This is how to explore your body. This is pleasure. This is all the wonderful things that sex could bring you.
00:03:02:22 - 00:03:06:15
Luna
What would you say right now? Is your favorite thing about sex?
00:03:06:17 - 00:03:27:13
Lilly
My favorite thing about sex is that you get to connect with the person that you're having sex with, like that intimate connection that you don't get from anything else in the same way you get from sex. Like, that's amazing. Like the aftercare and the cuddling, everything. Like, that's why I named my company after basically, it's like that intimate moment is what I love.
00:03:27:19 - 00:03:29:08
Lilly
I fucking love that.
00:03:29:10 - 00:03:32:06
Luna
What counts as sex for you?
00:03:32:08 - 00:04:00:20
Lilly
I think anything more than kissing counts as sex. That's a good question. Yeah. Definitely not just, you know, penis and vagina. I think we got to expand our definition. If I was in charge, I would say anything involving genitals. That's what I'm going to go with. Would you start taking the clothes off getting down there. Like seeing the parts we usually keep hidden like that.
00:04:00:20 - 00:04:04:13
Lilly
Sex in a non-clinical sense.
00:04:04:15 - 00:04:09:11
Luna
So what is sexy to you. Like what is Lilly Spark's personal definition of sexy?
00:04:09:13 - 00:04:23:04
Lilly
My personal definition of sexy is somebody who has the confidence about what they want. Somebody who's smart. Smart is super, super sexy for me and kind.
00:04:23:06 - 00:04:38:00
Luna
Okay. So you mentioned a little bit about like you didn't really get a sex education or you got kind of just the medical basics. But tell us more details. What do you remember actually learning in school. What do you remember learning from the adults in your life. And did you ever get an explicit lesson on consent?
00:04:38:02 - 00:04:57:16
Lilly
I remember getting this very awkward sex talk from my mom right when I started dating my high school boyfriend. Basically, what she said was, guys don't like to wear condoms, but you need to make them wear condoms. And I was a total typical teenager. I was like, thanks, mom, whatever. I'm already doing what I'm doing. I already know that.
00:04:57:16 - 00:05:19:18
Lilly
And like, please let me leave. When I think about where I actually got my education, you know, I grew up in the DVD era of porn. And I remember after prom, you know, we had like a group of eight people and we were all sitting around and like, somebody had this thing. I think it was called Young Girls in Prison.
00:05:19:18 - 00:05:48:18
Lilly
Like, that was the title, like typical, like funky porn movie. And, you know, that was the first time I'd seen people have sex, and it really helped me see what different things people were doing, because there's nowhere else where you can see it. So that was really fundamental in my experience. And for me, I would say in a mostly positive way, it didn't get me all the way there.
00:05:48:18 - 00:06:02:01
Lilly
You know, the porn that I was seeing did not focus on female pleasure. And so it taught me something. But I still wanted to know more, and I didn't have a resource for that. Wow.
00:06:02:03 - 00:06:07:03
Luna
So you were watching it before you had it yourself with that boyfriend, or were you guys already fooling around at that point?
00:06:07:05 - 00:06:18:16
Lilly
We were already fooling around at that point. You know, I had to go on this kind of long journey to figure out how to orgasm. And I would say porn helped me. It didn't get me all the way there. Okay.
00:06:18:18 - 00:06:35:19
Luna
How would you say if you had to put words to it? Does sex meet your needs for social interaction? Intimacy, or connection? Like you actually answered this earlier in terms of like what's sexy to you or what you love about sex the most, but like, can you put into words how those needs are met for you?
00:06:35:21 - 00:07:05:09
Lilly
I think there's something beautiful about sex that the oxytocin, the hormones, whatever is going on allows me to open up and communicate. I think the pillow talk, you know, I'm going back to that, that whole afterglow experience. But it's like you share your body with someone, you get naked, you reveal all the vulnerabilities. And sex is kind of this act of acceptance of those vulnerabilities.
00:07:05:09 - 00:07:14:17
Lilly
And like, oh, I find this hot, I want this, I want more, I want you. And then when it's all over, you're kind of just able to bask in it. That's amazing.
00:07:14:18 - 00:07:22:06
Luna
When did you know that you were straight and when did you know that you were monogamous? Like, for sure. I would say I.
00:07:22:06 - 00:07:46:13
Lilly
Still don't know. Oh, okay. Oh, you say? Oh, it's easy to be straight. You know, I love men. I love penises, I love giving blowjobs. I love all of that. Women are hot. Like, that's kind of a given. Like, if someone's, like, women are hot and, like, you know, do you not have eyes, like, what's going on? But maybe I just haven't met the right woman that I'm, like, super attracted to and want to have sex with.
00:07:46:14 - 00:08:08:15
Lilly
But, you know, I think I'm a believer in like that. Everybody's a little bit by or queer or curious. There was a time in my life, actually, when I was thinking like, oh, maybe I don't want to be monogamous, you know? Maybe I want to try, you know, having multiple relationships. But my partner was very pro monogamy. That's what he wanted.
00:08:08:21 - 00:08:27:08
Lilly
And, you know, I think there's a lot of value to it in terms of like, really, especially when you first are getting to know someone and dating them of like really being committed to that partner and really being committed to that person. And he's so amazing that I didn't feel like I was giving anything up in order to be monogamous with him.
00:08:27:10 - 00:08:28:01
Luna
I love that.
00:08:28:05 - 00:08:29:00
Lilly
Which I think is really.
00:08:29:00 - 00:08:34:23
Luna
Important. Yeah, yeah. If you're not missing anything, you don't need to seek anything else. That's perfect.
00:08:35:00 - 00:08:42:08
Lilly
Yeah. And now I'm like, I'm way too busy. And, like, one person is enough. Like, I'm way too busy for anybody else. Yeah.
00:08:42:10 - 00:08:48:01
Luna
Okay, so tell us now, what would you say are your best qualities as a lover?
00:08:48:03 - 00:09:13:11
Lilly
I think I am giving. I think that's probably one of my best qualities. I like to be in control. I like to kind of create that experience. I'm definitely better at being in control than I am at, like letting go and letting things flow. But I love that flow of sex that is different every time. And you want to make it new, exciting, put a spin on it.
00:09:13:12 - 00:09:21:06
Lilly
You know, do something fun, even if you're the one guiding it. It's still obviously a co-creation experience. Oh.
00:09:21:07 - 00:09:29:13
Luna
I love can you give us, like a little snapshot of what your sex life is like right now? And you're just like favorite highlight parts of it?
00:09:29:15 - 00:09:55:08
Lilly
It's really amazing. Even though, you know, at this point, me and my current partner, you know, we've been together for a couple of years. I would say we both like morning sex. So it's like wake up in the morning, Sunday morning and like, roll over and, you know, start the gentle touching to like, wake things up, start playing a little bit, get some toys involved.
00:09:55:08 - 00:10:13:22
Lilly
Because I'm really pro involving toys. I think they're fun. Yeah, things are really nice. We finally get to use that sex couch that I mentioned in the beginning, which we bought, but don't use that much. But it's super awesome. Keep going until we're done, until we're tired, and then we just get to lay there and make some breakfast.
00:10:13:22 - 00:10:15:16
Lilly
Have some coffee. Fuck yeah.
00:10:15:21 - 00:10:20:15
Luna
Fuck yeah. Do tell us about this couch. What is it? Peep this picture for us.
00:10:20:20 - 00:10:40:16
Lilly
It's narrow enough so that just one person lays on it, and it's got kind of like a bigger curve. And then a smaller curve. It's by the Liberator. And my partner got it for me when we first started dating. And we were having sex like a bunch and we were like, let's try all the things. I've always wanted to try this.
00:10:40:18 - 00:10:53:23
Lilly
And it's really great for creating, like, just these little different shifts and angles. Yeah, that, if you think about it like a bed is actually not that great of a tool or.
00:10:54:01 - 00:10:57:05
Luna
Not, especially these mattresses that don't have springs.
00:10:57:05 - 00:11:19:12
Lilly
Sometimes it's really hard to fuck on them. Exactly. Exactly. And I think it upgrades oral sex even more than it upgrades. Kind of like traditional sex. You know, like I'm able to, like Deep Throat a little better, you know, like maybe your legs will be on the ground so you can like more pressure to move up and down in the right ways compared to like one person kind of on their knees in a bed.
00:11:19:14 - 00:11:24:03
Lilly
It's a lot of fun. I still have a lot to do with it. Still have more to explore.
00:11:24:05 - 00:11:33:21
Luna
I can totally relate. So I am just going to admit to everyone I know. I've talked about this before. I found one of those on the street last year and it looked clean, so I picked it up and it's in my.
00:11:33:23 - 00:11:34:11
Lilly
Studio.
00:11:34:11 - 00:11:55:22
Luna
By my window and it's great for sexy photoshoots. It's so easy to perch on. I don't know what brand mine it like. It definitely is. I don't I don't know that it's a liberator, but it looked clean and then I washed it. Very sanitary. I love all of the different configurations, but I keep meaning to go like Google a manual or a book just so I can, you know, I'm very creative so I can make up lots of ideas in my head.
00:11:55:22 - 00:12:04:05
Luna
But it's also interesting because when I've had partners come over, I'm like, and we can use that. And they never want to. And so I'm like, what is.
00:12:04:05 - 00:12:21:00
Lilly
That? I see this a lot in myself and in a lot of people where it's like even us that are in the like sex positive industry and like, do this all the time. But like, we still have weird hang ups where we like, want to do things but don't do things, and I don't know where those come from.
00:12:21:00 - 00:12:22:22
Lilly
And I want to figure it out one day.
00:12:23:00 - 00:12:38:00
Luna
Yeah, yeah, I feel like sometimes I get self-conscious, like even now because I'm in the process of, like, crossing off bucket list items. And so, like, I'll have partners that literally are like, we're going to do this bucket list thing together. But sometimes there's like the translation between the plan and the actually doing it. I'm like, no, we're doing the thing.
00:12:38:00 - 00:12:53:09
Luna
Oh, you just want to come over. Okay. I guess going with the flow is good too. But, you know, like it's I totally I totally relate to all of that. Would you tell us what are health and safety conversations like for you? Okay, you're monogamous, but like you had to have them at least once. Like talk a little bit about that for us.
00:12:53:11 - 00:13:13:09
Lilly
So when my current partner and I first started dating, we lived in different cities and he was going to come visit me in my city. And it's actually funny sharing these anecdotes. And I keep thinking back to like, am I three? Or am I more shameful that I think I am because all of these things, I'm like, wait, I'm a little nervous and sharing this.
00:13:13:09 - 00:13:21:00
Lilly
I'm awkward. Like, it's really fun having this conversation kind of evaluating, like the different shame reactions to the question that you're.
00:13:21:00 - 00:13:27:23
Luna
Sharing that with us in real time too, because I love in myself, even noticing the weird places that I get surprised by shame.
00:13:28:01 - 00:13:47:03
Lilly
Yeah, yeah. So, you know, I remember thinking like, okay, like, you know, I have this porn company. I'm like, sex positive. He probably thinks all these things about me and instead, like, I need to call him and just be like, hey, like, when did you last get tested? You know, can you get tested before you come here? I'll get tested, too.
00:13:47:03 - 00:14:10:14
Lilly
We should share these because obviously you're flying to visit me like we're going to have sex. Like that's just going to happen. And I just need to be open and honest about that. So that was what the safety conversation looked like. And then using protection as well at the beginning. But it's one of those things where it's awkward to have the conversation, but it's like better to know how that person is going to react to those things.
00:14:10:14 - 00:14:12:14
Lilly
Like before you have sex with them.
00:14:12:14 - 00:14:13:04
Luna
Totally.
00:14:13:06 - 00:14:17:05
Lilly
It's like, if they're going to react poorly, wouldn't you rather know that sooner?
00:14:17:07 - 00:14:33:10
Luna
Absolutely. Yeah. And it's so funny because I've been in situations lately where I'll have the conversation, they'll be like, and I'm still a big fan of barriers, and then I'll get there and I'll be like wanting to use, you know, Laurel's the natural rubber latex panties for them going down on me and be like, well, and I was like, what does the word barriers mean to you?
00:14:33:14 - 00:14:46:07
Luna
You know, like, so it's yeah, it's just important to kind of like get on the same page ahead of time with that. And then so you guys then had a conversation about becoming fluid bonded or monogamous. And that's when you kind of it's at a different shift for you is that when you stop using protective.
00:14:46:09 - 00:14:53:18
Lilly
Yeah, exactly. That was like the different shift. It's like okay. Like we're monogamous. Like let's do this hot.
00:14:53:18 - 00:15:12:22
Luna
Okay. Now take us through your personal sexy timeline and like, highlight the most important formative experiences we heard about your boyfriend who became your husband for 15 years. Was there anything important before that? And then if you want to also, like, weave in when afterglow started, like tell us your sexy life story.
00:15:13:00 - 00:15:39:05
Lilly
One thing that's unique is that my 20s, because I was in this relationship and I actually started my career as an accountant, so my 20s were very stable, but I didn't feel like I was really following my path. And I think that was part related to my sexual journey, but also like kind of related to other things. Like I was more doing what I was told by society, by my parents.
00:15:39:05 - 00:16:00:14
Lilly
Kind of like, you should be successful, you should go to school, you should get married. Like kind of doing things a little less thoughtfully. And I think that was reflected in not having as much of a fulfilling sex life not being focused on, like, my own pleasure and like how things felt in my body and all of that.
00:16:00:14 - 00:16:26:00
Lilly
And the big moment for me was literally getting a vibrator, like it was as simple as like, go to the store. Like, have that awkward experience where you like, walk into the store and you're like, oh no, it's what do I choose? It's so scary. And having the, you know, super nice sex positive worker come and say, hey, like, you know, what are you looking for?
00:16:26:00 - 00:16:51:13
Lilly
What to do? Try me. And I got like a super basic Lelo vibrator and I still use the same one to this day. It's still my go to vibrator. I you know, it was my first orgasm. I found love with it. I'm never going to leave it. And like, I got in the path and I used it and I was like, oh, this is what everybody else is experiencing.
00:16:51:15 - 00:17:15:12
Lilly
And that helped me. And that even helped my sex life with, you know, my boyfriend slash husband at the time because I realized that the clit mattered, insects and that I needed that kind of stimulation. As you know, many, many women do. And I'm one of them. That really improved our sex life a ton because, like, I was actually enjoying it.
00:17:15:12 - 00:17:38:11
Lilly
I was actually like having a good time. And then after we split up, it's really funny being single for kind of the first time in your life when you're 30 years old, because there was a lot of silly mistakes that I had to make in kind of like dating and sex that I hadn't made before. But there were some that I didn't have to make this very stage.
00:17:38:11 - 00:17:56:06
Lilly
I was mature enough to know a few things, but other things I totally didn't know. I didn't go wild. I didn't go like, sleep with a bunch of people. But I was really wanting to explore that side of myself. Since I'd only been with one person, you know, until I was 30 years old. So I was like, okay, like, I'm here, I'm out.
00:17:56:06 - 00:18:01:10
Lilly
I want to have sex. But not with any of these people here.
00:18:01:12 - 00:18:02:15
Luna
Yeah, I can relate to that.
00:18:02:20 - 00:18:27:03
Lilly
So it was like a period of trying to figure out like what I wanted, I would say, and that's hard. And it was really fun getting to finally try, you know, like, you never know if you're going to like something till you try it. So, you know, I had a lot of awkward sexual experiences which like, weren't that great.
00:18:27:03 - 00:18:52:06
Lilly
And I was just kind of like, okay, that's not for me. It's either the theme is just like very outside the norm size penises, like either very small or very large. Like, I just want a nice average size one. Like, that's great for me. And just people that like, I wanted to feel that connection with. But then when you got down to it, you're like, I'm actually not that into that.
00:18:52:06 - 00:18:59:02
Lilly
And it's hard to judge that. It's hard to like, listen to your body and kind of like read those signals. Sometimes I would say, yeah.
00:18:59:04 - 00:19:05:09
Luna
When you say like into that, do you mean like just like the vibe between you and the person? Or are you talking about, like, specific kinks?
00:19:05:11 - 00:19:20:05
Lilly
I'd say more, just the vibe. I'm like a pretty vanilla person, so more just the vibe between me and that person was just like it was going well. But then it got a little off and then you're like, okay, do I like abort the mission? Yeah.
00:19:20:06 - 00:19:21:00
Luna
Yeah.
00:19:21:02 - 00:19:24:10
Lilly
Which is another really hard conversation. Absolutely.
00:19:24:11 - 00:19:32:06
Luna
Can you articulate those feelings of awkwardness? Because this is like why I'm even here? Because I think about all those times in my 20s where I just had these moments of like.
00:19:32:08 - 00:19:33:02
Lilly
The fuck is.
00:19:33:02 - 00:19:47:00
Luna
Happening? And looking back, I'm like, oh, I needed that person to hold an energetic container. They weren't capable. Like, oh, that person was wrapped up in their own shame, you know, until like, hindsight's 2020, do you have any like perspective from where you are now on those experiences? In that way.
00:19:47:02 - 00:20:11:14
Lilly
You know, the nice thing is that I always, you know, like, I always like I chose that experience, even if it didn't go well, you know, I took that risk. I took that gamble. I think it was either a shame. Like sometimes it was like a shame in me thing. Sometimes it was a shame in them things. Sometimes it was just like, we have different styles of sex that we're naturally drawn to, and it's just not a fit.
00:20:11:14 - 00:20:40:20
Lilly
Like, I think sex is this weird thing where we don't talk about it. And with my current partner when we were dating, I kind of asked him, like before he kind of came to visit me. I'm like, hey, like, what kind of sex do you like? Like trying to have that conversation in advance. Whereas with some of the more awkward experiences, I think I jumped into it and hoped it would go well, which is not really a strategy.
00:20:40:22 - 00:20:41:09
Lilly
I mean.
00:20:41:15 - 00:21:08:09
Luna
I think it's a really admirable spirit, and I actually really want to like, highlight and celebrate the fact that in our insane culture of perfection, seeking and like dishing out judgment upon ourselves and each other, you gave yourself the space to explore and to let it be imperfect. Because I think so many people I talked to had this idea that, like, I have my desire and when I finally, like, go out and pursue it, then I'll be perfect and happy and it's like, well, there's lots of messy in between.
00:21:08:09 - 00:21:10:15
Luna
So I think that's awesome.
00:21:10:17 - 00:21:35:04
Lilly
Yeah. So there was a lot of experiments. And before I met my partner, you know, I ended up having a couple of kind of friends with benefits situations of I had guys in different cities who were really like, sweet guys, good people. You know, maybe there wasn't real relationship potential there for whatever reason. Like partially the distance. And that really worked for me.
00:21:35:06 - 00:21:38:17
Lilly
I work a lot. I'm busy. They're super cute. They were super.
00:21:38:17 - 00:21:43:01
Luna
Nice. It's fun to miss someone and look forward to seeing them when they're far away.
00:21:43:01 - 00:22:01:04
Lilly
Yeah, exactly. I didn't have to talk all the time because they lived somewhere else, and so that was kind of like a thing I settled into and was really enjoying until I met my current partner. It's funny because I had a couple casual things going, and so I told them I'm like, hey, you know, I'm not really looking for something casual.
00:22:01:04 - 00:22:19:16
Lilly
And I thought he would just kind of back off, like, we'd be able to talk, we'd be able to flirt, but he wouldn't really try anything. And instead he's like, okay, cool. Like, let me come visit you. Let's talk more. Let's do this. Like, he's just like what he was really, like, committed and chasing. And I was like, oh, whoa.
00:22:19:16 - 00:22:25:01
Lilly
Like, okay, if you're serious, like, let's see where this goes. Cool.
00:22:25:04 - 00:22:39:20
Luna
Oh, that's amazing. Okay, before we get into like, those details and all the like, we also need to learn like where afterglow came from in this timeline, but I actually want to jump back to your, like, younger years. First we heard that you grew up conservative. Have we heard that you had a boyfriend by the time you're 15?
00:22:39:20 - 00:22:42:15
Luna
But like, tell us some of those details.
00:22:42:17 - 00:23:03:01
Lilly
Yeah. You know, I was very, like wholesome Disney movie, like, oh, let's kiss and get married and live happily ever after. Like, that was kind of always in my mind when I was maybe, like a little bit before I met my boyfriend, like 14, 15 was when I started to be like, oh boy, is like a little kind of teenage boy crazy.
00:23:03:01 - 00:23:13:05
Lilly
And I remember, like being at Jewish summer camp and my friends like, labeled me the boy crazy one. Like, that was my nickname. Oh.
00:23:13:07 - 00:23:19:17
Luna
I don't suppose. When did you learn what sex was? Was that in school or did you, like, know about it before the like, biology lessons?
00:23:19:19 - 00:23:33:11
Lilly
It's really hard to pinpoint. I feel like it was from watching TV, you know, like, oh, my God, there's a sex scene. And then it, like, stops before anything. Yeah, it's like, that was like my impression of what sex meant. Wow.
00:23:33:12 - 00:23:39:17
Luna
Okay, so boy crazy at summer camp. And is that how you, like, found your boyfriend? Like, how did that first one come to be?
00:23:39:19 - 00:23:57:18
Lilly
You know, he was sitting behind me in math class and, like, started chatting me up. And then we were together for 15 years. We got along great. Like we went to see, like our first date was like my big fat Greek wedding. And we, like, made out in the movie theater. Like it was like we would make out in his car all the time.
00:23:57:18 - 00:24:10:15
Lilly
It was just like a very it was a total high school romance that kept going and kept being fun. And we enjoyed each other's company and we loved each other. And, you know, it worked. Okay.
00:24:10:17 - 00:24:26:06
Luna
I want to hear about the slow but sure escalations in that relationship. First, I want to share my contrasting experience with meeting a boy in math class. I was sitting behind him and he turned around. He's like, it was an eighth grade class. And he said, Holy shit, you're a seventh grader. And he became my, like, formative secret hookup buddy.
00:24:26:06 - 00:24:31:21
Luna
Like I was the secret girl on the side. And so that for me, like, you have, like, the wholesome relationship with the first boyfriend and mine is, like.
00:24:31:21 - 00:24:33:07
Lilly
Very similar, but very different.
00:24:33:07 - 00:24:38:11
Luna
And I'm still, like, untangling my love triangle things. And I just think that's a really.
00:24:38:13 - 00:24:45:15
Lilly
I feel like I could just as easily have been in that role. Like, I don't think there's a rhyme or reason to it.
00:24:45:17 - 00:25:04:14
Luna
Well, it sounds like perhaps like I actually didn't realize that I had such a closed off feeling toward being in relationship, because still to this point, sometimes I feel like I'm waiting for this, like external signal to move forward, and I'm like, oh, it just comes from me. Like I'm, you know, or rather both of us. So it sounds like you and your boyfriend were your first partner.
00:25:04:14 - 00:25:19:13
Luna
We're able to kind of, like, sync up together in these ways. And it sounds like you eventually, like, had sex. What was the timeline like that? Like, was it yours? Was it months or was it like, how did you decide and what was your sexual debut like for you to whatever degree you for completion.
00:25:19:15 - 00:25:40:18
Lilly
So we waited about like seven months, which was forever. When you're in high school, like that's a super long time like I relationship, you know, because I had so much of that, you know, oh, sex is bad. Like when we were first getting together, I probably, like, had that idea of waiting to marriage, but I wasn't never as far as, like, a virginity pledge or anything.
00:25:40:18 - 00:26:02:01
Lilly
Like that. It was just the message was like, you should wait. You should make sure you really love the person. It should be really serious. You know, all of those things to make sure you're ready. And so basically, there was one night where I told my mom I was going for like a dance team sleep away thing, like it was happening on that day and his parents were going to be out of town.
00:26:02:03 - 00:26:20:09
Lilly
So I was like, okay, like, we can spend the night together. Like it can be really romantic. And it was like really sweet and beautiful and like, it's a wonderful memory that I cherish. And there was a little bit of like, oh, that's it. You know, like, oh, this isn't such a big deal. Like people make it out to be.
00:26:20:11 - 00:26:33:18
Luna
Okay. So what led you to when you were 24 being like, I need a vibrator. I'm going to go have this awkward experience at a sex shop. Like, what were the pieces that, like, got us there? You're like, I'm almost ten years into this relationship and I need an orgasm. Did you know that you weren't orgasming?
00:26:33:20 - 00:26:36:02
Lilly
That took a while to figure out.
00:26:36:05 - 00:26:37:13
Luna
Yeah, because how do you know.
00:26:37:15 - 00:27:04:04
Lilly
People talk about sex like it's this amazing thing, and what I'm experiencing is cool and fun, but it's not like I just knew there was something that I was missing, but I didn't know what it was. And I don't remember any, like, key moment. But I remember having a conversation with my boyfriend, like trying to figure out how to say, like, I'm not super enjoying this and I need something to change.
00:27:04:05 - 00:27:11:18
Lilly
Yeah, and that was really, really hard, especially with somebody like, it's harder with somebody who you've been with for a long time.
00:27:11:18 - 00:27:13:17
Luna
Exactly what I was thinking.
00:27:13:19 - 00:27:28:23
Lilly
Yeah, I think it was hard for him to hear it. I think it was hard for him to in that space. But that's kind of what led to going and trying the vibrator and trying different things and getting like a little bit more exploratory.
00:27:29:03 - 00:27:38:13
Luna
So you were able to have that conversation, then go get the toy. And because you'd already had that conversation, you were able to just bring it into the bedroom without like, it sounds like that wasn't the crunchy part. Okay.
00:27:38:17 - 00:27:39:16
Lilly
Yeah, exactly.
00:27:39:16 - 00:27:54:07
Luna
So then like, how do we get from like accountant to like, fuck it, I'm making porn and like, does your family know and like, what exactly do you do? Like, tell us about your sexy work. How are you making the world a more like place? And then bring us full circle to your current partnership?
00:27:54:09 - 00:28:18:14
Lilly
Okay, so after I was an accountant, I ended up kind of getting into the startup world and I started a natural food brand, actually super successful. I got our product into Whole Foods, like nationwide. It was awesome. And like, we kind of really created like a product that wasn't in the store before. And I really saw it, like, grow in popularity and like kind of become a thing.
00:28:18:16 - 00:28:22:18
Lilly
And that experience showed me that I could create change in this world.
00:28:22:18 - 00:28:25:06
Luna
That's so cool. What can you tell us what it was?
00:28:25:08 - 00:28:28:12
Lilly
It's g butter. I don't know if you've ever heard that before.
00:28:28:16 - 00:28:30:02
Luna
I know what G is like.
00:28:30:02 - 00:28:39:01
Lilly
I think everyone can create change in this world. But like, sometimes we just don't have an experience that really shows us, like, our own power that we have.
00:28:39:01 - 00:28:57:08
Luna
Oh my God. Yes, yes, yes, everybody stop and just listen to that right now. You have so much potential to create change the change that you want to see in this world. Lily has just told us and I can really relate to that feeling of like, oh, I didn't know this was this thing until I felt it, but it doesn't mean that it's not.
00:28:57:09 - 00:29:07:08
Luna
Rather, it does mean everything is possible. Okay, that's really cool. So you have that visceral, embodied experience of like, I can do a thing and it can spread.
00:29:07:12 - 00:29:14:23
Lilly
It can become like, it can spread, people can have it, you know, in their homes, in their living room, in their kitchens, all that stuff.
00:29:14:23 - 00:29:18:02
Luna
And I love that this is leading to porn.
00:29:18:04 - 00:29:43:00
Lilly
Yeah. Well said that when I moved on from that, you know, I was like, okay, like, what's the next big thing that I'm super passionate about that I believe should be really big, that I think I can really add my voice and my experience and like everything I'm good at, like, what can I put it into? And I wanted to love porn, like I wanted great porn.
00:29:43:00 - 00:29:58:01
Lilly
And I would go to Pornhub and, you know, it would turn me on. It would work, but it wasn't speaking to me. And I'm just like, you know, these TVs and, you know, like the Bridgerton and the movies, like, I also love to read romance novels.
00:29:58:03 - 00:30:02:02
Luna
But just romance or like erotic romance novels.
00:30:02:04 - 00:30:06:07
Lilly
You write romance like with sex. Okay, 100%.
00:30:06:09 - 00:30:11:00
Luna
I just learned that both exist. I thought they all had sex in them, and I didn't realize.
00:30:11:02 - 00:30:28:03
Lilly
Yeah, no, I don't know why people read the ones without taxes. To be honest. I was like reading Bridgerton like before it was a TV show and all of that stuff. And I was like, well, like, why can't I get a point of this? Like, I love TV, I love movies, I love these romance novels getting turned on.
00:30:28:04 - 00:31:08:17
Lilly
Like, what's the disconnect here? That was kind of where it started, was like simply like porn for women, like, let's make something hot, you know, that speaks to people like me and a female audience. And, you know, as I kind of dug deeper into, why did I want to create this, you know, I was thinking about like how I had really wanted to use erotic videos as a tool for my own sex life and like, you know, all the sexual exploration that I did and like I had recently done this kind of like guided masturbation experience, which was really powerful and really amazing.
00:31:08:17 - 00:31:26:22
Lilly
And I'm just like, I wanted to make something for my younger self, for myself, you know, at 18, 19, that would have helped me figure these things out faster. Yeah. And that was really like the Genesis of afterglow.
00:31:27:00 - 00:31:33:15
Luna
Wow. Okay. So what were like the first steps? Also, what is your actual role like? Are you in them? Do you do.
00:31:33:15 - 00:31:56:01
Lilly
Them? Yeah, I'm not in them. I'm the founder and CEO. I'm a terrible actor. Like I'm just a bad actor. So I would be like the worst. Yeah. So I started the company and when I started it, I had no connections in porn. I didn't know anyone. I didn't know anybody in the adult industry. I didn't know how to make a movie.
00:31:56:01 - 00:32:03:08
Lilly
I didn't know how to make a website. But I knew I knew how to figure things out, and I knew I knew how to learn things.
00:32:03:09 - 00:32:10:15
Luna
Okay, I think that is very sexy. Like there's a sexy way to move through the world would be like goal going to put puzzle pieces together.
00:32:10:17 - 00:32:33:08
Lilly
That's how I think. Yeah. So I feel like six months, like just trying to talk to anybody that I could find that knew anything about porn and like trying to, like, make those connections. And I ended up talking to rooster, who's like an ethical porn advocate. They were super helpful. They're like, here's all these resources, here's all these links, here's all these people you should talk to.
00:32:33:10 - 00:32:58:08
Lilly
And like that felt like kind of a big break in terms of like starting this company. That kind of led to our first producer, who was a performer and whose work I love and helped us make our first films. Then we did like an Indiegogo campaign, and then we launched the site, and I got into this whole, like, ethical porn world and like, discovered all these cool producers.
00:32:58:08 - 00:33:36:00
Lilly
And I was like, oh my God, like, I wish I'd known that these people existed, like, I don't I didn't even know, you know, who Erika Lust was, who's like one of the most amazing, like, feminist pornographer filmmakers right now. And, you know, that kind of started this whole journey. And I think our whole perspective and afterglow has always been around, like, we just want to bring more awareness to all of these really amazing people that are out there wanting to make porn in a way that feels really good, really empowering, really pleasurable, amazing.
00:33:36:02 - 00:33:44:17
Luna
Would you say that you identify as a sex worker, or do you identify more as like part of the sex industry and like, where do you think that line exists?
00:33:44:18 - 00:34:10:19
Lilly
I don't think I've had to go through a lot of the things that sex workers have to go through in order to call myself a sex worker. I definitely do consider myself a part of the sex industry. And, you know, as part of that industry, we have all the problems with like advertising and banking and financial regulations. But like, I haven't had to put like my personal self out there in the same way that I think you do as a sex worker.
00:34:10:23 - 00:34:11:18
Lilly
Got it.
00:34:11:20 - 00:34:23:04
Luna
Can you give us like a little snapshot of what the day in the life or maybe for you, like week or month in the life is kind of like like like what do you actually deal with? What are you most excited about in your day to day and what are the least sexy parts?
00:34:23:06 - 00:34:42:00
Lilly
So I got an email this morning that was like this fucking yes or no. And we were like having a debate about, you know, a film that we're editing and there's like a face fucking scene and we're like, you know, do we want to do it? Not is it aggressive? You know, what is it like really to our ethics?
00:34:42:00 - 00:35:04:17
Lilly
Like, you know, which is really fun and then later in the day we have like a way that we like pay our vendors and they email me and they're like, you're an adult platform. You can't use our service anymore. After seven days. Screw you. Oh, damn. Yeah. It's also really fun how sometimes the really sexy hot things can just become very banal.
00:35:04:17 - 00:35:22:17
Lilly
And to you, like now, I can't when I watch porn, it, like, doesn't turn me on because I'm just thinking about like, what tags are people looking for? Like, is this going to meet these criteria? Like, does it you know, ethical guidelines, like it becomes work. But I also love to work. So I get it. It's just a.
00:35:22:17 - 00:35:28:18
Luna
Different mode when it puts me in producer or director brain. I'm sort of it's a different kind of turn on.
00:35:28:20 - 00:35:29:06
Lilly
Yeah.
00:35:29:08 - 00:35:41:14
Luna
Now what are your favorite parts and are you part of the like creative concept or you more like talent selection, like you're the vision holder for the company. So, you know, how are you making those decisions about your ethics and what you're calling in?
00:35:41:16 - 00:36:13:05
Lilly
You know, I have a lot of really awesome people who have like, worked with me and advised me over the time, and I right now wear a lot of different hats. I do a lot of the different jobs. A lot of times I will who is experienced to help do a lot of the like. So production stuff like the directing, the camera holding, like I'm not a like I said, I had no idea how to make a film and I still don't, but I do know how to kind of like now I know a lot more about how to talk about it and like what needs to happen to make it happen and to make
00:36:13:05 - 00:36:35:06
Lilly
it look good. But I really rely on the amazing people that I work with for a lot of the like making the creative vision come to life type stuff, both on the filmmaking side and on like the website tech side. Also, I'm really kind of like the maestro who's like conducting the orchestra on like, you know, making it all happen and making it all come together.
00:36:35:06 - 00:36:48:11
Lilly
But it's really a lot messier than that. It's really more like a Band-Aid thing together. That's like constantly coming apart. You constantly have the more Band-Aids to, like, check it to get it to stay.
00:36:48:12 - 00:36:57:06
Luna
I was having a vision of you as, like a wild West, like sexy cowgirl. Like trying to lasso tornadoes of creation. That's what I. Yeah, it's. Yeah, it's a lot.
00:36:57:08 - 00:37:02:07
Lilly
Yeah, I like that. That's way better than either of the things that I said.
00:37:02:09 - 00:37:14:11
Luna
My past is as a filmmaker, producer, photographer. And so I production is always difficult. Anyone who wants to ever criticize a film, I'm like, go make your own movies and then come back and tell me what you think.
00:37:14:14 - 00:37:36:21
Lilly
I'm very much in like the startup, like business building, like I did it with my natural food brand and we get to like, hire people on salaries and kind of like build a team over time that we like, enjoy working with. But filmmaking is much more like Burning Man, where you're just like, okay, how these people are free right now and we have to like, check all this stuff out.
00:37:36:21 - 00:37:44:06
Lilly
And then we get there and we forgot half the stuff. And like, we still I'm amazed. Like, whenever I watch a movie like that, it ever happened.
00:37:44:08 - 00:37:49:18
Luna
I know I feel the same way. What have you experienced that never would have happened if it weren't for afterglow?
00:37:49:20 - 00:38:12:08
Lilly
One thing that has not even just happened once is that the male performer can't get hard. And it's funny because you know when I'm like at a party and I'm talking about what I do, people are like oh like why don't you put me in the film and like that, that's like a common joke that dudes make.
00:38:12:10 - 00:38:46:04
Lilly
And then I'm like, look, these guys are like professional girls and like, it's so much pressure. It's so intense. Like having all these cameras on you, like, I wouldn't want to be in that position. So I always like whenever I get that comment from people, I just want to be like, you don't even understand. Like with all the different films we've made, it's just given me so much respect for the performers who are able to show up, get completely naked, be comfortable, have sex with somebody they just met five minutes ago, look great doing it.
00:38:46:06 - 00:38:50:09
Lilly
It's amazing. It really blows my mind every single time.
00:38:50:11 - 00:39:00:21
Luna
That's great. Okay, so how would you describe the filter that you use to make decisions about what you're creating and putting into the world through afterglow?
00:39:00:23 - 00:39:19:23
Lilly
I really try to think about our customers. One thing I love doing is talking to our customers and hearing their stories, and they're all like, so amazing and so sweet. And so I always just try to think about what's their mindset like, what do they want, what they like this. Yeah.
00:39:20:00 - 00:39:27:07
Luna
For people who maybe are new to the idea of ethical porn, how do you describe it when you're introducing someone to the concept?
00:39:27:09 - 00:39:49:10
Lilly
I describe it as people who care about the impact of what they're making on the world. There's different types of porn that I like to kind of break down. There's sexual abuse material, which is not porn, it's illegal. And that's like when there's sex trafficking or not consent or anything like that. Like that's illegal. It's not porn. Yeah.
00:39:49:12 - 00:40:12:08
Lilly
And then there's what I like to call douchebag porn, which is kind of like the mainstream tube sites. And they're kind of run just like any other company is run like as a capitalist enterprise, trying to pay people as little as they can get away with, trying to make the most money as possible. You know, that's not any different because it's sex or because it's porn.
00:40:12:08 - 00:40:32:08
Lilly
It's the same as most industries are run. And, you know, a lot of people don't care that much. Yeah. And then there's ethical porn where, you know, people are just trying to make the world a better place in the ways that they care about. And so that could be about, you know, paying performers well and making it a great experience for them.
00:40:32:08 - 00:40:40:18
Lilly
That could be about the type of stories that they tell. It can really be defined very differently by the individual who's trying to make it. Yeah.
00:40:40:19 - 00:40:50:05
Luna
What would you say that you have noticed or learned about sex related shame and pleasure, either because of your work or just your life experience?
00:40:50:07 - 00:41:09:23
Lilly
I've learned that it that goes really deep sex is really a core part of who we are, which we don't really integrate a lot. And I like we, we kind of have like our outward facing personas in society which have like nothing to do with sex. And then sex is supposed to be this private thing that's like not talked about.
00:41:09:23 - 00:41:11:13
Luna
But it's like all related.
00:41:11:15 - 00:41:38:00
Lilly
And it's all related. Yeah. I think as I've kind of become more accepting of myself sexually, it's just helped, I would say, in all areas of my life, sometimes when I'm talking about afterglow, say like sexual health and like sexual wellness, it's like the next wave of like mental health. Like we finally got over that shame of, like talking about mental health and like, I think sex is kind of like the next big wave that we need to start talking about.
00:41:38:02 - 00:41:46:20
Luna
Oh, I'm here for it. I'm so here for it. How would you say your sex related work has informed or influenced your personal sex life?
00:41:46:22 - 00:42:02:08
Lilly
Yeah, it's made me more open to experimentation. It's made me more accepting. It's made me now like, people could tell me what whatever crazy kink they had. And I would just kind of be like, yeah, cool, man. Do it. Yeah, I love you. Never, never worry.
00:42:02:13 - 00:42:06:23
Luna
Like I'm like, if it's legal and consensual, I love to hear about it.
00:42:07:01 - 00:42:15:02
Lilly
Yeah. It's just made me more open, more empathetic. I would say to everybody in kind of like their different journey, which is awesome. Yeah, yeah.
00:42:15:08 - 00:42:31:06
Luna
But in your own personal life, like, have you ever, like, gotten an inspiration from something you've encountered and or like, what was it like dating? It's you said that you had already like, give us the timeline on afterglow. How old is it? And it sounds like it was already established when you were single and dating.
00:42:31:08 - 00:43:15:12
Lilly
Yeah. So afterglow is about three years old. I started it probably about four years after my divorce. It really helped as a filter for dating because, you know, based on the reactions I would get from guys about it, it would tell me a lot about them and whether or not I was interested in them or not. So, yeah, I was definitely when I was single, I was like, am I ever going to find somebody who, like, loves me and my weird porn company and like, gets what I'm trying to do, like, doesn't kind of like judge because, you know, as my story is probably told like I'm a pretty vanilla person, so I feel like
00:43:15:14 - 00:43:35:15
Lilly
people would perceive me a lot as, you know, some crazy sex monster or something. I don't even know what I was worried about. My partner now has a cannabis business so that a lot of how we got introduced or like, yeah, the first time we met, he was like asking me like about like, well, how do you acquire your customers and like, what's your marketing?
00:43:35:15 - 00:43:44:14
Lilly
And like, all of this kind of like he he was asking me all about like, the business and like, not really about the porn. And I was like, I love this guy.
00:43:44:16 - 00:43:57:18
Luna
That's amazing. It is funny how cannabis and sex are lumped together just because they're like a drill, you know, kind of like on the edge of society industries, because I get sometimes the reach outs from cannabis people that are like collab. But I'm like, I mean.
00:43:57:20 - 00:43:58:16
Lilly
Sure, but.
00:43:58:16 - 00:44:02:01
Luna
Like, that's not part of my brand. But like, I do like, okay.
00:44:02:01 - 00:44:13:23
Lilly
You know, totally anecdotal, but like, I think sex people love weed and weed people love sex. Like, there's definitely like some synergies that happen between those two things.
00:44:14:00 - 00:44:20:17
Luna
That's actually that is a very anecdotal. I'm all about anecdotal research, and I think that that is an accurate observation in many cases.
00:44:20:19 - 00:44:37:23
Lilly
A lot of people who are now really like sex positive and in the sex industry, I think, do come from like more reserved, conservative, repressive backgrounds. Like that's another totally anecdotal thing that I think has held true for me. And I've heard a lot in a lot of people's stories.
00:44:37:23 - 00:44:54:10
Luna
It's about liberation. I mean, we're the frontier people, right? Like, and the people who started out more liberated, I've noticed interviewing people, a lot of them are just like chilling in their life because they don't have to, like, climb this mountain. Whereas, like, I have a history of getting rejected, even though I'm very sexy and I'm like trying to figure out sex my whole life long.
00:44:54:10 - 00:45:10:18
Luna
So it's like, okay, we're giving our lessons. Yeah. Do you have to think very much about like, work life versus personal life boundaries or like because you're monogamous and not that kinky? Like, it sounds like you're kind of like on lock, but you have to think about that or talk about kind of like boundaries in the workplace sex wise.
00:45:10:20 - 00:45:35:06
Lilly
I think it definitely does come up, for example, being on this podcast and wondering, you know, having to talk to my partner about, you know, what are you comfortable with me sharing about our sex life versus not because I want to be respectful there. It comes up now and then in funny ways in our work slack group, you know, not wanting to push people to go beyond their boundaries and like disclosing things.
00:45:35:08 - 00:45:52:14
Lilly
Some people are like, oh, is it okay? Like, I went to a sex party yesterday and I met this person, and maybe they'll be attracted for afterglow and like, they're really hot, blah blah, blah. Like it's funny, you know, it's like, okay, like there's a performer that I really like, can I email them and be like, oh, you're so hot.
00:45:52:14 - 00:46:09:19
Lilly
I love your videos. Like what's like an appropriate way to, you know, be a fan, engage with them. You know, it's not like going out partying and, you know, sleeping with porn stars, but it comes up in kind of these more, more small, like, funny settings.
00:46:09:20 - 00:46:32:12
Luna
Yeah, totally. Totally. I can really relate to all of that, especially now that I have friends in porn. And I'm like, wait, am I allowed to watch your stuff? And they're like, yeah. And I'm like, okay, am I allowed to like it to your face? And they're like, uhhuh. And then, you know, so back to your own personal life or your own physical being to the degree that you are comfy, what are the biggest turn ons and turn off what gets you going and then what stops?
00:46:32:12 - 00:46:48:22
Lilly
What are your breaks? Yeah, I definitely think touch and music and like dancing, body movement. Like that's always what like gets me out of my head and into my body like it's dance. And I love that. That's a total turn on.
00:46:48:22 - 00:46:51:08
Luna
Do you do that with and for your partner.
00:46:51:10 - 00:47:06:03
Lilly
Oh we like make playlists for each other and stuff like that. Yeah. And I'd say like my number one like it's not even a turn off. It's just what shuts me down. And it's just stress.
00:47:06:05 - 00:47:21:14
Luna
Yes totally. And I just want to I'm such an advocate of sleep. I want to say that most people are more stressed when they're not sleeping a lot. And we live in a culture that's like, I got by on four hours of sleep, you know? So I'm always like aiming for night. Yeah, maybe I'll get seven. Yeah.
00:47:21:15 - 00:47:33:19
Lilly
So you wake up like it's related. Yeah. You wake up, you're not stressed. You're able to. Just like the biggest turn on is, like, not having a schedule and, like, not having any deadlines. That's all I need. Yeah.
00:47:33:21 - 00:47:40:06
Luna
And then a partner to, like, touch me. What are your favorite forms of touch to receive? And it doesn't necessarily have to be general, but also.
00:47:40:06 - 00:47:50:06
Lilly
That I love all kinds of types, like I'm a I'm a cuddle, but like I love cuddling. I love touching and kissing like, oh, good kiss. Like ooh ooh.
00:47:50:07 - 00:47:50:21
Luna
Ooh.
00:47:50:23 - 00:47:51:12
Lilly
So great.
00:47:51:13 - 00:47:57:21
Luna
What about your kind of linguist anxiety? What is that and how does it show up for you? And how are you welcoming a shift?
00:47:57:23 - 00:48:25:22
Lilly
Yeah, I think that's what contributed to, like, kind of my lack of orgasm, even as a teenager is just that, like not feeling like I deserved pleasure. I think like a lot of our, you know, like TV shows and stuff, like sex is more for the guy in a way. I think that was like when I grew up, a lot of the narratives, and so I didn't know what I should be feeling or receiving or anything.
00:48:25:22 - 00:48:37:20
Lilly
And I think that's still why I like to be a little bit more of like the one in control and the one like kind of creating the flow to a certain extent. I love that.
00:48:37:22 - 00:48:46:10
Luna
And I love that you are now like making porn that carries that energy. What are your future hopes, goals and dreams for your sex life?
00:48:46:12 - 00:48:59:01
Lilly
My number one hope is to have even better sex than I've had before. Like to hit new highs like that would be amazing. Yeah. And just to not be complacent.
00:48:59:03 - 00:49:02:04
Luna
Okay. So like still just exploring.
00:49:02:06 - 00:49:06:13
Lilly
Imitating the playfulness. Yeah. Yeah. Oh that's so good.
00:49:06:15 - 00:49:12:08
Luna
Through your work have you noticed any sex related norms that you like. Really would just love to shift.
00:49:12:10 - 00:49:18:21
Lilly
I still cannot believe how many people do not use lube.
00:49:18:23 - 00:49:20:12
Luna
For observation.
00:49:20:14 - 00:49:44:07
Lilly
Or like, think that using lube means something is wrong with them. Yeah, I actually own use more lube.com. Like, you know, you get into this industry and you're like threesomes and this and that and I'm like, okay, like, let's just get everybody on lube. Yeah. Damn. Yes, I love that. Yeah.
00:49:44:09 - 00:49:50:09
Luna
Especially if anyone wants to touch my butt. I mean, yeah, someone just go in for the day. I was like, whoa.
00:49:50:09 - 00:49:51:18
Lilly
Whoa whoa whoa whoa.
00:49:51:19 - 00:50:01:10
Luna
He's like, you don't like buff stuff. And I was like, not. I was like, I'm very serious about butt stuff. And we don't just put fingers there without talking about it, and certainly not without.
00:50:01:12 - 00:50:04:22
Lilly
Like, it. That is why I. Yeah. Thank you right here.
00:50:05:02 - 00:50:19:14
Luna
Yeah. And I'm also like. And the way to bring this up is not like in the bedroom in the moment. In the dark. Sir. Who wanted to turn the lights off. I was surprised by that. I well, I was thinking about your awkward experiences. I was like, have you had moments where people you're like, on a date with them?
00:50:19:14 - 00:50:25:01
Luna
And so, you know, you go to the next step where you're alone and private together and suddenly it's like a completely different person.
00:50:25:03 - 00:50:30:16
Lilly
And I'm like, oh, no, not. Yeah, exactly. And like, totally.
00:50:30:18 - 00:50:37:19
Luna
What are you the most excited to explore in your work going forward? Like what's coming up for afterglow? What do you feel lit up by?
00:50:37:21 - 00:50:53:14
Lilly
I want to make more films. Like, I have so many ideas that I feel like aren't covered. I just want to keep making stuff and I want people to see it. And like, it's pretty simple, but that is what makes me really happy. Oh fuck yeah.
00:50:53:16 - 00:50:58:13
Luna
If you could wave a magic wand and teach everyone in the whole wide world something about sex.
00:50:58:15 - 00:51:00:03
Lilly
What would it be?
00:51:00:05 - 00:51:02:01
Luna
Obviously we covered lube.
00:51:02:03 - 00:51:16:08
Lilly
That it's okay to talk about. It taught to talk about it. It's hot to talk about it and that their pleasure matters. That it matters if it feels good that like it should feel good. And if it doesn't, you can stop. Yeah.
00:51:16:10 - 00:51:24:06
Luna
And if you could go back in time and give younger you a piece of sex related advice, what age or ages would you pick and what would you say?
00:51:24:08 - 00:51:38:12
Lilly
I mean, I'd probably just like, give myself a vibrator as a teenager and be like, it's that's a time. Masturbate, explore your body. Like, I just wish I'd known about my body more at a younger age.
00:51:38:17 - 00:51:44:02
Luna
Yeah, I relate to that. Oh, also, what is the shape of your lelo? Which one do you have?
00:51:44:04 - 00:51:52:00
Lilly
It's like round. It's like a small, round kind of anguish. Okay. One. Yeah. It's great. That's awesome.
00:51:52:01 - 00:52:05:20
Luna
Okay, lastly, a fantasy brainstorm. If you had an unlimited budget to build a sexy playroom or house or a production studio, etc. for yourself or for afterglow, what would it be like?
00:52:05:22 - 00:52:34:01
Lilly
I would love to build like an office slash production studio for afterglow. That's just pink, but not annoyingly pink and like, bright and like fluorescent and like very daytime iridescent stuff and have different rooms that we could do all sorts of different filming and like, they'd be like the blue and pink disco room. There'd be like the iridescent, shimmery daytime room.
00:52:34:06 - 00:52:40:06
Lilly
There'd be like a fuzzy room, you know, there'd be just like all of these different things. Fuck yeah.
00:52:40:08 - 00:52:45:14
Luna
Is there anything else you want to say about sex in general or anything you want to tell us about afterglow?
00:52:45:16 - 00:53:08:11
Lilly
We have such amazing films. On afterglow, I wanted to talk about one of my favorites, and it's actually like the first one we made. It's called Lip Service, and there's actually no penetration in it. It's all kind of lingus, and it's this woman who's like, really vocal and like, telling her partner what she wants as he's going down on her.
00:53:08:11 - 00:53:33:23
Lilly
And there's also a little bit of like a fire stick aspect to it. In conjunction with that, we actually have a guided audio exercise that you do with your partner around kind of lighting. So like this has really helped me with like my kind of like a society because it's like it even helps you just create a shared language with your partner about, you know, what the circles mean to them or like their previous partner like it could be such different things.
00:53:33:23 - 00:53:43:12
Lilly
Like, you know, those two things have been life changing for me and would love for people to check them out. I love that and lovers.
00:53:43:12 - 00:53:55:19
Luna
You can find afterglow on the internet at Twitter at XO, afterglow on Instagram at XO. Afterglow with two W's. I feel like that's probably because of the takedown. And also of.
00:53:55:19 - 00:53:57:21
Lilly
Course, yeah, TikTok.
00:53:57:23 - 00:54:05:21
Luna
The sex stories just got taken down. I'm like, fuck, I don't got to do something, okay? And definitely visit the website XO afterglow.com.
00:54:05:23 - 00:54:16:20
Lilly
Everybody who's listening, you can get a seven day free trial to afterglow. If you go to XO, afterglow.com and you sign up with the code lover lover. Awesome.
00:54:16:22 - 00:54:21:00
Luna
Thank you Lily sparks for being a guest on Sex Stories.
00:54:21:02 - 00:54:27:20
Lilly
Thank you so much for having me. It was so much fun. You made me reveal more than I intended to, but I think that's a good thing.
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